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Author
Bk Ray

Moderator

Member Since: Sat May 17, 2008
Posts: 6,527



Not stamina, healing factor or pain tolerance, just hard durability.

Thor
Luke Cage
Thing
Hulk
Colossus
Gladiator
US Agent
Wonder Man
Silver Surfer
Iron Man



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JesusFan


Member Since: Sat May 17, 2008
Posts: 17,427


Depends on which Hulk, but classic one had Superman like durability
Glads
Thor
Col
Thing/IM
Thing
Luke
Us agent


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Joe Fixit


Location: Virginia
Member Since: Thu Apr 09, 2009
Posts: 5,101




    Quote:

    Not stamina, healing factor or pain tolerance, just hard durability.



    Quote:
    Thor
    Luke Cage
    Thing
    Hulk
    Colossus
    Gladiator
    US Agent
    Wonder Man
    Silver Surfer
    Iron Man


You mean simply how tough their outer shell is essentially?

Hmmm my best guess.....

Silver Surfer
Gladiator
Hulk(classic) I prefer this version over the healing factor
Colossus
Wonder Man
Hulk (current)
Thing
Iron Man
Thor
US Agent


I know Luke Cage is suppose to have nigh impenetrable skin, but I'm still not sure where he'd rank on this list?





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Knight


Member Since: Sat May 17, 2008
Posts: 9,280



Thor
Gladiator
Silver Surfer
Hulk
Iron Man
Wonder Man
Thing
Colossus
Luke Cage
US Agent





It's interesting that a hero/villain performs one amazing feat, or use a power they haven't used for 20+ years, and that automatically propels them to a high status despite scans and evidence to the contrary. I don't know what is worse, selective feat picking that has only been done once or twice 20, or more, years ago or ignoring evidence from scans or the lack thereof. We need to stop putting our favorite heroes/villains on pedestals and start putting them where they really belong. But it's evident that people never will because they would rather accuse others of cherry picking feats, when they don't, and being 'morally superior' when they aren't. I guess being honest and as fair as possible only opens one up to being the target of childish accusations and fault finding by those who insist on acting petty and childish. What happened to a good debate between two civil, mature, adults?
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bouken red


Member Since: Sat Jul 15, 2017
Posts: 299


Arranged starting from the toughest to injure...

Silver Surfer
Gladiator
Thor
Hulk
Wonder Man
Thing
Colossus
Luke Cage
Iron Man
US Agent



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Oliva


Member Since: Sat May 17, 2008
Posts: 2,423



    Quote:


      Quote:

      Not stamina, healing factor or pain tolerance, just hard durability.

      Quote:

        Quote:
        Thor
        Luke Cage
        Thing
        Hulk
        Colossus
        Gladiator
        US Agent
        Wonder Man
        Silver Surfer
        Iron Man



    Quote:
    You mean simply how tough their outer shell is essentially?



    Quote:
    Hmmm my best guess.....



    Quote:
    Silver Surfer
    Gladiator
    Hulk(classic) I prefer this version over the healing factor
    Colossus
    Wonder Man
    Hulk (current)
    Thing
    Iron Man
    Thor
    US Agent



Man, you really have a very low opinion of Thor, don't you? Placing him next to last? According to you, probably it's a downright miracle that US Agent didn't beat Thor on this list.. How the heck exactly have Thor survive blows by the Hulk, Gladiator, Thanos, Durok, Odin, Surtur, etc.?

http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/11111/111116655/3041341-casually-blows-away-thor-and-thing-8804.jpg

http://www.universomarvel.com.aq/imagen.php?img=Thor/Thor_estrella_neutrones_1.jpg

http://www.universomarvel.com.aq/imagen.php?img=Thor/Thor_estrella_neutrones_2.jpg


http://www.universomarvel.com.aq/imagen.php?img=Thor/Thor_gammenon.jpg


    Quote:

    I know Luke Cage is suppose to have nigh impenetrable skin, but I'm still not sure where he'd rank on this list?





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Joe Fixit


Location: Virginia
Member Since: Thu Apr 09, 2009
Posts: 5,101



Naw, I just don't share your opinion. *insert Debbie Downer noise here* I like the character, but what was asked for in the thread was hard durability, not stamina, not how much of a beating he can take. I take that to mean simply how tough his outer hide/exterior is and/or his resistance to injury. The Hulk is a great example of this. Classically he could take hits from powerful opponents and you rarely saw him bleed....then the healing factor retcon came in and he was seen getting injured and bleeding much more frequently, but healing extremely fast, especially during the PAD years. Thor has shown he can take a beating, but his skin has also been penetrated by a bullet. On the other hand he's also been shown to be bulletproof on several occasions as well. Classically he was often seen deflecting bullets with Mjolnir, one time saying "luckily I can deflect the shells with my enchanted mallet before they can strike me", implying bullets might hurt him to some degree. More often than not I'd say Thor is bullet proof or at least bullet resistant. However, the fact that it can even be called into question shows that his hard durability should not put him high on this list.





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UName


Member Since: Tue Mar 10, 2015
Posts: 386


So should probably be above Colossus at least?


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Bk Ray

Moderator

Member Since: Sat May 17, 2008
Posts: 6,527




    Quote:

    Naw, I just don't share your opinion. *insert Debbie Downer noise here* I like the character, but what was asked for in the thread was hard durability, not stamina, not how much of a beating he can take. I take that to mean simply how tough his outer hide/exterior is and/or his resistance to injury. The Hulk is a great example of this. Classically he could take hits from powerful opponents and you rarely saw him bleed....then the healing factor retcon came in and he was seen getting injured and bleeding much more frequently, but healing extremely fast, especially during the PAD years. Thor has shown he can take a beating, but his skin has also been penetrated by a bullet. On the other hand he's also been shown to be bulletproof on several occasions as well. Classically he was often seen deflecting bullets with Mjolnir, one time saying "luckily I can deflect the shells with my enchanted mallet before they can strike me", implying bullets might hurt him to some degree. More often than not I'd say Thor is bullet proof or at least bullet resistant. However, the fact that it can even be called into question shows that his hard durability should not put him high on this list.


Giving him excellent body armour (20), but unearthly endurance (100). Also, Wonder Man was noted in the Korvac arc as being more impervious to harm, amazing body armour (50) and monstrous endurance (75).



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Oliva


Member Since: Sat May 17, 2008
Posts: 2,423



    Quote:

    Naw, I just don't share your opinion. *insert Debbie Downer noise here* I like the character, but what was asked for in the thread was hard durability, not stamina, not how much of a beating he can take. I take that to mean simply how tough his outer hide/exterior is and/or his resistance to injury. The Hulk is a great example of this. Classically he could take hits from powerful opponents and you rarely saw him bleed....then the healing factor retcon came in and he was seen getting injured and bleeding much more frequently, but healing extremely fast, especially during the PAD years. Thor has shown he can take a beating, but his skin has also been penetrated by a bullet. On the other hand he's also been shown to be bulletproof on several occasions as well. Classically he was often seen deflecting bullets with Mjolnir, one time saying "luckily I can deflect the shells with my enchanted mallet before they can strike me", implying bullets might hurt him to some degree. More often than not I'd say Thor is bullet proof or at least bullet resistant. However, the fact that it can even be called into question shows that his hard durability should not put him high on this list.


Oliva: Listen up, I do not follow things that do not make any sense at all, but if you want to- then that's your business. If someone like the Hulk or Durok that could so easily penetrate the armor of Tanks with a simple soft blow, what do you think it would happen to Thor if he was just bullet resistant? Thor would suffer severe life threatening wounds (as a result), and the bleeding wouldn't be stopping any time soon- that's what would really happen. Moreover, Thor's been hit very hard by the likes of a no holding back Gladiator and Hyperion at super-speed no less with no life threatening trauma or blood to show. Thor also has been hit by Heat seeking missiles that could obliterate Airplanes and Tanks with no effect on his person whatsoever. Finally, Thor resisted the explosion of a Doomsday Bomb that could literally destroy an entire Planet, and, subsequently, fell from orbit and SURVIVE!!! Do you think that if Thor was bullet resistant that he would've survive the intense friction upon entering the Planet's atmosphere?

It is not about stamina or the ability to take punishment that would make someone like Thor invulnerable or able to resist such unreal and unimaginable punishment w/o bleeding, etc., but a pretty tough and Hard durability factor that seems to be at work; if not Thor would've not survived none of the most powerful physical blows he has received throughout his illustrious career. Thus, for Thor to have easily survived such lethal attacks, he must have a high degree of Invulnerability.


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Braugi


Member Since: Fri Jul 14, 2017
Posts: 470


I will rank them in terms of hard durability, and then again in terms of overall durability.

Diamond takes more to do an initial amount of damage than some metals, but exceed that and it might break, while the metal deforms and can take more overall punishment...Thor has a high strength, but low hardness in materials terms i.e. low barrier to ding iron or whatever, but it deforms, and won't break easily, while a 'harder' material may not deform under low impacts, but breaks easily when hit with a hammer that would do minimal damage to the iron...

Gladiator- about equal with Superman
Silver Surfer - could be here or in the top spot

Wonder Man- clear gap between the top guys, I think Wondy is clearly
next on the list though

Luke Cage- I think there's a clear gap between Cage and the top guys
but I think he's durable way outside his weight class
and he's been upgraded a couple times in power from the
5 ton days...I think he's slightly more durable
than Colossus and Thing, but all three are in the same
ballpark
Thing
Colossus
Iron Man - not much difference between IM and Cage, all these guys are
peers IMO and I could see moving them into almost any order

Hulk - classically would have been a peer to the top 2, at the peak of
his healing factor, he drops below Thor, but usually is similar
to the guys in the next category
Thor - .50 cal bullets seemed to raise welts...lowest threshold to
take any damage of almost any heavy hitter except Wonder Woman
but among the highest overall damage soakers in comics...akin
to a relatively malleable metal...bends a lot but never seems
to break

USAgent: nowhere near the Hulk/Thor level


Overall strength (by strength, I'm talking 'material strength' analog, not how much they can lift...how much stress needs to be acted before 'failure' is reached.

Hulk- with his healing factor being the most efficient on this list,
he's far and away number 1

Gladiator-I give him the nod over Thor because while I think they're
pretty even, I give the tie to hard durability
Thor

Surfer: I think maybe its mental toughness that bumps him lower, but
the top 4 are still far and away the highest...clear gap after
this one


Thing- again, I think mental toughness is the deciding factor,
see the champion fight for details
Luke Cage
Colossus
Iron Man?
Wonder Man still, all these guys are kind of close

USAgent -nowhere near the others



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Joe Fixit


Location: Virginia
Member Since: Thu Apr 09, 2009
Posts: 5,101



It's clear we have a different opinion on hard durability. Thor can take punishment, but his skin is not as tough as many of the others on this list. Like I said he's also been hurt by a bullet, though it's more the exception than the rule. Even still, you likely wouldn't see that from many others on this list. Again I think classic Hulk and modern Hulk are perfect examples of differences in hard durability. We disagree on this, no big thing, but ditch the petulant attitude.





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Member Since: Fri Jul 21, 2017
Posts: 96


I don't think that Ironman, Thing, Cage, Wonder Man or Collossus would survive even one punch from Mangog. Thor took 30 or 40 and kept coming back.


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Joe Fixit


Location: Virginia
Member Since: Thu Apr 09, 2009
Posts: 5,101




    Quote:
    I don't think that Ironman, Thing, Cage, Wonder Man or Collossus would survive even one punch from Mangog. Thor took 30 or 40 and kept coming back.








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Oliva


Member Since: Sat May 17, 2008
Posts: 2,423



    Quote:

    It's clear we have a different opinion on hard durability. Thor can take punishment, but his skin is not as tough as many of the others on this list. Like I said he's also been hurt by a bullet, though it's more the exception than the rule. Even still, you likely wouldn't see that from many others on this list. Again I think classic Hulk and modern Hulk are perfect examples of differences in hard durability. We disagree on this, no big thing, but ditch the petulant attitude.


Not petulant, but an indignant attitude based on your projection of Thor been next to last when history proves convincingly otherwise. I do not based my opinion on what fans or writers that are bias might say, but on an educated guess based on hard facts. If Thor can walk through the core of a Sun, it means that he's beyond bulletproof; otherwise he would be dead miles before he gets close to the Suns' surface. And he supposed to be threatened by an ordinary bullet? Now, Marvel officially have stated that Thor is bulletproof, but I knew that a very long time ago based on facts- not opinion.

http://www.universomarvel.com.aq/imagen.php?img=Thor/Thor_dentro_sol_01.jpg




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Comicguy1


Member Since: Tue Apr 04, 2017
Posts: 1,056


Then I would say Thor.


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Poltargyst


Member Since: Sat Nov 29, 2008
Posts: 2,929



    Quote:

    Not stamina, healing factor or pain tolerance, just hard durability.



Gladiator
Hulk = Silver Surfer
Thing = Colossus = Wonder Man = Iron Man
Thor
US Agent








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Poltargyst


Member Since: Sat Nov 29, 2008
Posts: 2,929


There is hard durability, which is what is asked for by the OP, and then there is damage soak. And then there is durability vs. physical attacks or durability vs. EP, heat, cold, radiation, etc.

No one is questioning Thor's damage soak, his ability to take one hell of a beating before dropping. It is his hard durability that is in question. Thor standing in the sun...awesome display of durability vs. heat and radiation. Not informative, though, about Thor's hard durability vs. physical attacks.


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Poltargyst


Member Since: Sat Nov 29, 2008
Posts: 2,929



    Quote:
    I don't think that Ironman, Thing, Cage, Wonder Man or Collossus would survive even one punch from Mangog. Thor took 30 or 40 and kept coming back.


It's Thor's damage soak that allows him to hang in longer than the others, along with some hard durability.


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Joe Fixit


Location: Virginia
Member Since: Thu Apr 09, 2009
Posts: 5,101



I never questioned Thor's ability to take a beating, but his hard durability is in question. It's rather presumptuous for you to claim your take is a fact while mine is an opinion. We have a difference of opinion on hard durability is all. It doesn't serve much of a point to repeat myself, so check Braugi's post. He gives a good explanation of hard durability vs the ability to take punishment and keep coming aka overall durability. Contrary to what you may think I don't dislike Thor. Hell I have two long boxes filled with Thor comics. I'm fairly well versed in his capabilities and history.





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Joe Fixit


Location: Virginia
Member Since: Thu Apr 09, 2009
Posts: 5,101









RCO003_1480412174
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UName


Member Since: Tue Mar 10, 2015
Posts: 386


Or at least consider it in a "mystical/godly" way and not someone actually standing in the heart of the sun.

He would not only have to deal with temperature and radiation there, but also pressure and "physical" attacks, far beyond anything the likes of Hulk can deal out.


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Knight


Member Since: Sat May 17, 2008
Posts: 9,280



Hasn't Thor taken Wolverine's Adamantium Claws to the face and they only managed to scratch him? Pretty sure that counts as much higher Durability than Thing (who failed to take a claw hit from Logan), Colossus, Luke Cage and Iron Man. There is simply no way in the world those guys I just mentioned have ANY degree of durability that is higher than Thor.





It's interesting that a hero/villain performs one amazing feat, or use a power they haven't used for 20+ years, and that automatically propels them to a high status despite scans and evidence to the contrary. I don't know what is worse, selective feat picking that has only been done once or twice 20, or more, years ago or ignoring evidence from scans or the lack thereof. We need to stop putting our favorite heroes/villains on pedestals and start putting them where they really belong. But it's evident that people never will because they would rather accuse others of cherry picking feats, when they don't, and being 'morally superior' when they aren't. I guess being honest and as fair as possible only opens one up to being the target of childish accusations and fault finding by those who insist on acting petty and childish. What happened to a good debate between two civil, mature, adults?
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The Shuruku Demon


Member Since: Sun Jan 04, 2009
Posts: 10,401


In terms of their ability to withstand blunt force trauma, I'd rank them something like this:

Hulk
Gladiator
Thor
Silver Surfer
Wonder Man
Thing
Colossus
Iron Man
Luke Cage
US Agent


In terms of their ability to withstand being cut, something like this:

Silver Surfer
Gladiator
Wonder Man
Colossus
Luke Cage
Iron Man
Hulk
Thing
Thor
US Agent




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motifian


Member Since: Sat Jun 10, 2017
Posts: 1,129



Good list but Hulk is pretty low in terms of cutting durability. Even in recent times he has shrugged off adamantium bullets under Waid and under Pak Cho Hulk was taking slashes from OML without much damage until momentum was used to cut him.

Also surfer has one clear showing against Molecule Man where he showed better blunt force durability than Thor. Can't think of any such showing for Thor.


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MysteryMan


Member Since: Fri Apr 28, 2017
Posts: 1,298


Silver Surfer
Gladiator
Colossus
Wonder Man
Iron Man
Thing
Luke Cage
Thor
Hulk
US Agent

...not close to overall durability though



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The Shuruku Demon


Member Since: Sun Jan 04, 2009
Posts: 10,401



    Quote:
    Good list but Hulk is pretty low in terms of cutting durability. Even in recent times he has shrugged off adamantium bullets under Waid and under Pak Cho Hulk was taking slashes from OML without much damage until momentum was used to cut him.


The Hulk's resistance to cuts has varied alot over the years; that ranking probably does tend towards the lower showings, although the lower showings have been more prevalent in recent decades than the higher end stuff. Admittedly, I wasn't aware of the two showings you cited. Hulk shrugging off adamantium bullets in particular is quite a surprising showing for him to have in the modern era.

Thor may be a little low too, on reflection. He and Jane have been getting better showings in terms of being bulletproof in recent years.


    Quote:
    Also surfer has one clear showing against Molecule Man where he showed better blunt force durability than Thor. Can't think of any such showing for Thor.


I could see those two being flipped around; they were right next to each other on that list anyway, and those were only rough lists. There're a few other characters I might rank slightly differently on a different day, depending on my mood.




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motifian


Member Since: Sat Jun 10, 2017
Posts: 1,129



    Quote:

      Quote:
      Good list but Hulk is pretty low in terms of cutting durability. Even in recent times he has shrugged off adamantium bullets under Waid and under Pak Cho Hulk was taking slashes from OML without much damage until momentum was used to cut him.



    Quote:
    The Hulk's resistance to cuts has varied alot over the years; that ranking probably does tend towards the lower showings, although the lower showings have been more prevalent in recent decades than the higher end stuff. Admittedly, I wasn't aware of the two showings you cited. Hulk shrugging off adamantium bullets in particular is quite a surprising showing for him to have in the modern era.


Yes, it was. Under Waid Hulk was all but indestructible (pun intended).

https://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/11/118689/3768059-hulk+%231+016.jpg

Hulk was even noted to be weakened.


    Quote:
    Thor may be a little low too, on reflection. He and Jane have been getting better showings in terms of being bulletproof in recent years.


Being bulletproof. Aaron has Thor surprisingly squishy and he has been run through by simple spears and gored by minotaur and mystique stabbed him through by an ice shard.




    Quote:

      Quote:
      Also surfer has one clear showing against Molecule Man where he showed better blunt force durability than Thor. Can't think of any such showing for Thor.



    Quote:
    I could see those two being flipped around; they were right next to each other on that list anyway, and those were only rough lists. There're a few other characters I might rank slightly differently on a different day, depending on my mood.


But I don't think Thor has ever shown he has a clear edge on surfer in terms of blunt force damage. Surfer has however.


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The Shuruku Demon


Member Since: Sun Jan 04, 2009
Posts: 10,401



    Quote:

      Quote:
      The Hulk's resistance to cuts has varied alot over the years; that ranking probably does tend towards the lower showings, although the lower showings have been more prevalent in recent decades than the higher end stuff. Admittedly, I wasn't aware of the two showings you cited. Hulk shrugging off adamantium bullets in particular is quite a surprising showing for him to have in the modern era.


    Yes, it was. Under Waid Hulk was all but indestructible (pun intended).

    https://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/11/118689/3768059-hulk+%231+016.jpg

    Hulk was even noted to be weakened.


That's a great showing. I actually prefer a Hulk with high durability and lower healing (still superhuman, but not Wolverine level), rather than the other way around.


    Quote:

      Quote:
      Thor may be a little low too, on reflection. He and Jane have been getting better showings in terms of being bulletproof in recent years.


    Being bulletproof. Aaron has Thor surprisingly squishy and he has been run through by simple spears and gored by minotaur and mystique stabbed him through by an ice shard.


It could be argued that a Minotaur's horn would hit harder than a bullet. Same goes for a spear made of the metal of Asgard (or some other godly realm), thrown by someone with 35 ton level strength (Hawkeye's arrows could pierce Piledriver's skin, even though it was acknowledged that Piledriver is bulletproof). That ice shard showing sounds very inconsistent with Thor being bulletproof though.


    Quote:

      Quote:
      I could see those two being flipped around; they were right next to each other on that list anyway, and those were only rough lists. There're a few other characters I might rank slightly differently on a different day, depending on my mood.


    But I don't think Thor has ever shown he has a clear edge on surfer in terms of blunt force damage. Surfer has however.


As I said, I could see those two being flipped around.




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motifian


Member Since: Sat Jun 10, 2017
Posts: 1,129



    Quote:

      Quote:

        Quote:
        The Hulk's resistance to cuts has varied alot over the years; that ranking probably does tend towards the lower showings, although the lower showings have been more prevalent in recent decades than the higher end stuff. Admittedly, I wasn't aware of the two showings you cited. Hulk shrugging off adamantium bullets in particular is quite a surprising showing for him to have in the modern era.



      Quote:
      Yes, it was. Under Waid Hulk was all but indestructible (pun intended).



      Quote:
      https://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/11/118689/3768059-hulk+%231+016.jpg



      Quote:
      Hulk was even noted to be weakened.



    Quote:
    That's a great showing. I actually prefer a Hulk with high durability and lower healing (still superhuman, but not Wolverine level), rather than the other way around.


Me too. Him being so squishy made little sense considering how his durability was for better part of three decades.




    Quote:

      Quote:

        Quote:
        Thor may be a little low too, on reflection. He and Jane have been getting better showings in terms of being bulletproof in recent years.



      Quote:
      Being bulletproof. Aaron has Thor surprisingly squishy and he has been run through by simple spears and gored by minotaur and mystique stabbed him through by an ice shard.



    Quote:
    It could be argued that a Minotaur's horn would hit harder than a bullet. Same goes for a spear made of the metal of Asgard (or some other godly realm), thrown by someone with 35 ton level strength (Hawkeye's arrows could pierce Piledriver's skin, even though it was acknowledged that Piledriver is bulletproof). That ice shard showing sounds very inconsistent with Thor being bulletproof though.


Yeah it can be but cutting durability doesn't stops on bullets. Barring Diana and Thor I'm not sure any top tier has showed any vulnerability to bullets in a long time.

Here it is. TBH, Iceman was portrayed in a very high light in the arc.

http://i.imgur.com/1rPm94v.jpg


    Quote:

      Quote:

        Quote:
        I could see those two being flipped around; they were right next to each other on that list anyway, and those were only rough lists. There're a few other characters I might rank slightly differently on a different day, depending on my mood.



      Quote:
      But I don't think Thor has ever shown he has a clear edge on surfer in terms of blunt force damage. Surfer has however.



    Quote:
    As I said, I could see those two being flipped around.


Fair enough.


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The Shuruku Demon


Member Since: Sun Jan 04, 2009
Posts: 10,401



    Quote:

      Quote:
      It could be argued that a Minotaur's horn would hit harder than a bullet. Same goes for a spear made of the metal of Asgard (or some other godly realm), thrown by someone with 35 ton level strength (Hawkeye's arrows could pierce Piledriver's skin, even though it was acknowledged that Piledriver is bulletproof). That ice shard showing sounds very inconsistent with Thor being bulletproof though.


    Yeah it can be but cutting durability doesn't stops on bullets.


No, but the recent showings of Thor/Jane being bulletproof were notable in that Thor didn't seem to be solidly bulletproof under some previous writers (most notably Busiek). Gave me the impression that more recent writers were raising his hard durability up a bit.


    Quote:
    Barring Diana and Thor I'm not sure any top tier has showed any vulnerability to bullets in a long time.


It's abnormal for a top-tier to be vulnerable to bullets, no question about it. Thor's relationship with bullets is weird though, in that he wasn't confirmed to be bulletproof or not until the 1990s. And since then, writers have flip-flopped back and forth over it.

It makes sense to me that Thor wouldn't be as quite as invulnerable as someone like Superman. He comes from a realm where bladed weapons are routinely used, and fights mythical creatures with sharp teeth and claws, so it seems appropriate that he can be injured by such things. That's not the same as a human with a handgun or an ice shard being able to take him out though. It seems ridiculous for a being of Thor's might to be laid low by something so mundane.




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