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JesusFan


Member Since: Sat May 17, 2008
Posts: 17,778


Who would take this fight, assumingKal can use the ring about as well as Hal?


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motifian


Member Since: Sat Jun 10, 2017
Posts: 1,173



    Quote:
    Who would take this fight, assumingKal can use the ring about as well as Hal?


Superman doesn't needs the ring to beat Surfer.


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Knight


Member Since: Sat May 17, 2008
Posts: 9,682



Surfer takes one look at the ring and turns it to lead then takes one look at Superman and learns what his weaknesses are (Yes, he can do that), then turns his suit into Kryptonite.

Surfer wins





It's interesting that a hero/villain performs one amazing feat, or use a power they haven't used for 20+ years, and that automatically propels them to a high status despite scans and evidence to the contrary. I don't know what is worse, selective feat picking that has only been done once or twice 20, or more, years ago or ignoring evidence from scans or the lack thereof. We need to stop putting our favorite heroes/villains on pedestals and start putting them where they really belong. But it's evident that people never will because they would rather accuse others of cherry picking feats, when they don't, and being 'morally superior' when they aren't. I guess being honest and as fair as possible only opens one up to being the target of childish accusations and fault finding by those who insist on acting petty and childish. What happened to a good debate between two civil, mature, adults?
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motifian


Member Since: Sat Jun 10, 2017
Posts: 1,173



    Quote:

    Surfer takes one look at the ring and turns it to lead then takes one look at Superman and learns what his weaknesses are (Yes, he can do that), then turns his suit into Kryptonite.



    Quote:
    Surfer wins


We're talking about Silver Surfer here. Not Molecule Man.


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123


Member Since: Fri Jul 21, 2017
Posts: 105




Posted with Mozilla 11.0 on Windows 7
123


Member Since: Fri Jul 21, 2017
Posts: 105


In the Marvel/DC Crossover 6 – Superman and Silver Surfer were in the same story. Almost all of the time, in crossovers, the heroes fight each other first and then realize that they are on the same side and ultimately team up.
However, in this crossover they do not fight each other first.
Why do you think that is?
It’s simple; DC would not allow ANY Marvel character to get the best of their most popular hero. The writers and editors at DC, knowing that Superman basically has almost no chance against the Surfer, stipulated that the only way for them to be in the same story is for them not to fight each other at all.
If there was any logical way for Superman to win, DC would've made sure that they fought just to have Superman beat another one of Marvel's top heroes.


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motifian


Member Since: Sat Jun 10, 2017
Posts: 1,173


He can just turn off a GL ring and create kryptonite ? Got a scan for that?


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motifian


Member Since: Sat Jun 10, 2017
Posts: 1,173



    Quote:
    In the Marvel/DC Crossover 6 – Superman and Silver Surfer were in the same story. Almost all of the time, in crossovers, the heroes fight each other first and then realize that they are on the same side and ultimately team up.
    However, in this crossover they do not fight each other first.
    Why do you think that is?
    It’s simple; DC would not allow ANY Marvel character to get the best of their most popular hero. The writers and editors at DC, knowing that Superman basically has almost no chance against the Surfer, stipulated that the only way for them to be in the same story is for them not to fight each other at all.
    If there was any logical way for Superman to win, DC would've made sure that they fought just to have Superman beat another one of Marvel's top heroes.


If DC did not want Superman to lose to Surfer, they would just have Superman beat Surfer. The writer didn't write any fight between both.

Do you have any source citing that the editors and writers thought so? Because Superman's main writer Dan Jurgens said Superman would beat Surfer 99 times out of 100 times.

And guess what, Cyborg Superman and Silver Surfer fought under Ron Marz who was writing Surfer's book and if anything Surfer came up short in the fight.


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Knight


Member Since: Sat May 17, 2008
Posts: 9,682




Here are few examples of Silver Surfer's transmutation power at work.

  • Transmutes rock into a harmless gas.
  • Transmutes gold into sand.
  • Transmutes a napkin dispenser into a gold bar.
  • Restructures the molecules of the Obliterator's weapons to shoot harmless light.
  • Transmutes an enemy's weapon into its basic atoms.

    That last one proves the Silver Surfer can transmute that GL ring into lead or any number of different things. Then he can energy drain Superman in a similar way he drained the Hulk

    Tries to drain a Banner-less Hulk of gamma radiation and nearly kills Hulk in the process.
  • Easily stops the Hulk's strike and absorbs Hulk's gamma radiation, causing Hulk to revert back into Bruce Banner

    Superman is powered by the sun, Surfer can use that to drain him and give himself an additional boost in power.

    Absorbs the Sun's energy to greatly increase his power.


    Then there's the fact that Silver Surfer sensed Gladiator's weakness to a certain frequency of radiation and claims he could fell Gladiator easily if he chose to exploit it. He can do the same to Superman by sensing his vulnerability to Kryptonite, recreating it with his transmutation power and easily beat Superman in a fight.

    Sense's Gladiator's weakness and lets him know he can take him down with ease if he exploits it.


    Can Superman win against the Surfer? Of course. But not the majority of the time.








  • It's interesting that a hero/villain performs one amazing feat, or use a power they haven't used for 20+ years, and that automatically propels them to a high status despite scans and evidence to the contrary. I don't know what is worse, selective feat picking that has only been done once or twice 20, or more, years ago or ignoring evidence from scans or the lack thereof. We need to stop putting our favorite heroes/villains on pedestals and start putting them where they really belong. But it's evident that people never will because they would rather accuse others of cherry picking feats, when they don't, and being 'morally superior' when they aren't. I guess being honest and as fair as possible only opens one up to being the target of childish accusations and fault finding by those who insist on acting petty and childish. What happened to a good debate between two civil, mature, adults?
    Posted with Mozilla 11.0 on Windows 7
    motifian


    Member Since: Sat Jun 10, 2017
    Posts: 1,173



      Quote:


      Here are few examples of Silver Surfer's transmutation power at work.






      Quote:
      That last one proves the Silver Surfer can transmute that GL ring into lead or any number of different things. Then he can energy drain Superman in a similar way he drained the Hulk


    C'mon, these are parlor tricks of transmutation. GL rings can do far better transmutation than that.

    How about Superman turns Surfer's body into anti matter and watches him explode?

    http://www.majorspoilers.com/wp-content/uploads/2007/08/14GLC/GLC5.jpg






    Hulk isn't Superman though and doesn't has the control over his solar radiation.

    Superman has done exactly that to Hulk analog Rampage.

    https://static1.comicvine.com/uploads/original/11118/111183975/5265753-9485993453-18757.jpg


      Quote:
      Superman is powered by the sun, Surfer can use that to drain him and give himself an additional boost in power.


    Or Superman uses the GL ring to drain Surfer who has been drained dozens of times and Kyle has actually drained power cosmic out of Parallax.




    Superman absorbed an entire sun.

    http://imgur.com/a/aHR4A

    Surfer nearly blew up absorbing a small portion of sun's power.


      Quote:

      Then there's the fact that Silver Surfer sensed Gladiator's weakness to a certain frequency of radiation and claims he could fell Gladiator easily if he chose to exploit it. He can do the same to Superman by sensing his vulnerability to Kryptonite, recreating it with his transmutation power and easily beat Superman in a fight.





    He already knew of his weakness. There was no sensing for weaknesses there.


      Quote:

      Can Superman win against the Surfer? Of course. But not the majority of the time.



      Quote:






    Superman can win majority of times on his own. Add a GL ring and it's a stomp.


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    Braugi


    Member Since: Fri Jul 14, 2017
    Posts: 575


    Surfer's EP is still superior, but it's a lot closer. Ring allows Supes to counter energy drain or kryptonite radiation, enough that it's a non issue.

    Supes is a little stronger and may have a combat speed advantage. I think this goes like Thor vs Surfer....Supes wins.

    Actually it's worse. GL ring durability + Supes means you won't be able to hurt him.....Surfer is in trouble


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    Oliva


    Member Since: Sat May 17, 2008
    Posts: 2,445



      Quote:

      Surfer takes one look at the ring and turns it to lead then takes one look at Superman and learns what his weaknesses are (Yes, he can do that), then turns his suit into Kryptonite.



      Quote:
      Surfer wins


    When it comes to manipulation any kinds of Cosmic energies- there're few that can top the Surfer; and he can do this on a vast scale. GL's powers are based on energy projections that can be manipulated and countered. Moreover, GL's ring energies will be drained if he uses it extensively; whereas the Surfer's energies stays the same or he can even absorb more energy from the Cosmos itself. If the Surfer survives the explosion of a Super Nova that can destroys counter Jupiter size Planets to nothing; or destroy a Planet itself- his energy levels won't change an iota. The Surfer can do the same thing Photon did vs the Green Lantern in that infamous Avengers/JLA crossover. However, the strength and durability of Superman would make things interesting for the Surfer, but ultimately the Surfer will inevitably win.






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    motifian


    Member Since: Sat Jun 10, 2017
    Posts: 1,173



      Quote:
      Surfer's EP is still superior, but it's a lot closer. Ring allows Supes to counter energy drain or kryptonite radiation, enough that it's a non issue.


    Surfer doesn't has EP superior to Superman much less Superman+GL ring.


      Quote:
      Supes is a little stronger and may have a combat speed advantage. I think this goes like Thor vs Surfer....Supes wins.


    Superman is a lot stronger and faster than Surfer on his own.


      Quote:
      Actually it's worse. GL ring durability + Supes means you won't be able to hurt him.....Surfer is in trouble


    Well, that's about it.


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    motifian


    Member Since: Sat Jun 10, 2017
    Posts: 1,173



      Quote:

        Quote:

        Surfer takes one look at the ring and turns it to lead then takes one look at Superman and learns what his weaknesses are (Yes, he can do that), then turns his suit into Kryptonite.

        Quote:

          Quote:
          Surfer wins



      Quote:
      When it comes to manipulation any kinds of Cosmic energies- there're few that can top the Surfer; and he can do this on a vast scale.

    Fortunately Green Lantern ring is even bigger plot device than power cosmic.
      Quote:



      GL's powers are based on energy projections that can be manipulated and countered. Moreover, GL's ring energies will be drained if he uses it extensively; whereas the Surfer's energies stays the same or he can even absorb more energy from the Cosmos itself. If the Surfer survives the explosion of a Super Nova that can destroys counter Jupiter size Planets to nothing; or destroy a Planet itself- his energy levels won't change an iota. The Surfer can do the same thing Photon did vs the Green Lantern in that infamous Avengers/JLA crossover. However, the strength and durability of Superman would make things interesting for the Surfer, but ultimately the Surfer will inevitably win.


    No, he will not win this.


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    Braugi


    Member Since: Fri Jul 14, 2017
    Posts: 575


    unless you're dealing with Ion or something, no GL is anywhere near as powerful as Surfer in terms of energy projection. Nor is Superman. His HV is powerful, but not on Surfer's level.

    Note that Surfer has at least one tactical speed feat that is easily high end flash level, though that is not the norm. Speed is unlikely to be a decisive factor.

    Power output of this Superman would be very similar to Surfer's. But, Superman could more effectively protect against energy drain or kryptonite radiation. Stacked durability means Surfer would have a hard time hurting him, and in a lot of cases, durability wins fights...so Supes becomes the favorite, but only really because of his durability.


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    JesusFan


    Member Since: Sat May 17, 2008
    Posts: 17,778


    The ring should allow Kal to take energy absorption and Greek K fine, and so he can focus on getting close into Norrin and make this into just what Thor tends to do to him, hammer time!


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    motifian


    Member Since: Sat Jun 10, 2017
    Posts: 1,173



      Quote:
      unless you're dealing with Ion or something, no GL is anywhere near as powerful as Surfer in terms of energy projection. Nor is Superman. His HV is powerful, but not on Surfer's level.


    We can try to compare feats on this if you want. Some of the most powerful feats from GLs are after 2002.

    Superman's HV is more powerful than a standard blast from Surfer.


      Quote:
      Note that Surfer has at least one tactical speed feat that is easily high end flash level, though that is not the norm. Speed is unlikely to be a decisive factor.


    And what speed feat that would be? Yes, it would be since Surfer's combat speed is almost non existent.


      Quote:
      Power output of this Superman would be very similar to Surfer's. But, Superman could more effectively protect against energy drain or kryptonite radiation. Stacked durability means Surfer would have a hard time hurting him, and in a lot of cases, durability wins fights...so Supes becomes the favorite, but only really because of his durability.


    That's a very faulty level of reasoning. Feats of Surfer that put him on the level of Superman or a GL's range of energy blasts let alone them combined?


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