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Post By
Happy Hogan 
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Location: Northern Virginia
Member Since: Sat May 17, 2008
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In Reply To
America's Captain 
Maintainer

Location: Bayville New Jersey
Member Since: Sat May 17, 2008
Posts: 10,756
Subj: Re: On the subject of arrogance
Posted: Tue Jan 16, 2018 at 09:34:04 pm EST (Viewed 113 times)
Reply Subj: Re: On the subject of arrogance
Posted: Tue Jan 16, 2018 at 08:17:42 am EST (Viewed 123 times)

Previous Post


    Quote:

    He also needed to stall for Jarvis to finish his new armor. (He may have told Loki he wasn't stalling, but he couldn't very well tell Loki what he was really doing could he?) His speech had a lot of bravado, but it's possible to look at the speech as stopping just short of being truly arrogant.


I agree. What the speech had was "swagger." It could almost have been put to rhyme and made into a rap song.

In addition to stalling for time, I think Tony was actually trying to put some doubt into Loki's mind. The invasion might succeed but Loki wouldn't survive it, at least not unscathed, because the Avengers would target him to the end.


    Quote:
    If I'm not mistaken, the same director of that scene also had Batfleck be what would usually be uncharacteristically humble during Justice League; just to make up for the arrogance and murderous tendencies he (Batman) was showing during Batman v Superman. The point being that at least Joss Whedon is aware that arrogance can be overdone in a character.


See? It's always Batman we compare to Tony. Batman, whom everybody thinks is just so awesome. It amazes me that Marvel never really gets the message. Tony is their Batman. Not Cap. Not Moon Knight. Not the Panther. Not (if we're grasping at straws) the Punisher. Marvel's Batman is Iron Man. But Marvel seems oblivious or resistant to this fact.

Sure, the two characters are different. Tony pilots a form-fitting fighter jet while Bruce swoops around with an entirely impractical cape blowing in the wind. But Tony built that fighter jet, and Bruce built the warrior's body and detective's mind he wields against criminals. Both men are self-made champions. They both represent the best that humanity is capable of.

We're used to thinking like that about Batman: the best that humanity is capable of. Why does it feel odd to think about Tony that way? It shouldn't feel odd. The plain truth is, humanity is the ape that developed technology, and Tony is the supreme avatar of the technologist, while also being brave, selfless, and relentless in the pursuit of justice. Tony is the ultimate man. Bruce, likewise, is the ultimate man, just from a different angle.

If Marvel could only grasp this - that Tony is their Batman - their whole vision of where to go with him would radically change.









Sorry, but it's not quite like that. Tony isn't Marvels Batman. If Marvel has a Batman, (and I'm not sure they do) it would be the Black Panther.

What Tony Stark is, is Marvel's Bruce Wayne. By this I mean that when he created Iron Man, Stan Lee used what Bruce Wayne pretended to be to the world at large, a character so into himself, nobody should ever believe this self centered man could be a hero. Stan turned the concept on it's head when he showed that what DC thought nobody would believe was capable of more, and then created a hero out of him. But his methods are vastly different. Hes never used use the night like Batman, or worked to create fear like Batman.

BTW, Stan did this for one other hero also. Just like Tony Stark is Marvel's Bruce Wayne, he took the concept of what everyone in the DC world believed about Clark Kent and then created Peter Parker.

But Tony isn't Marvel's Batman any more than Peter is Marvel's Superman.




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