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Member Since: Sun Nov 26, 2017
Posts: 17
In Reply To
Jeff M

Member Since: Fri Jul 29, 2011
Posts: 179
Subj: Re: You make many good points.
Posted: Mon Nov 27, 2017 at 09:13:03 pm EST (Viewed 695 times)
Reply Subj: You make many good points.
Posted: Mon Nov 27, 2017 at 01:00:07 pm EST (Viewed 703 times)

    I agree that Marvel is doing the films far better. They put the building blocks down first allowing them to pretty much hit any genre they want and have it be true to their universe. If they were on opposite eachother, I’d watch Ragnarok over JLA. The way Marvel developed the movies matches the way DC created their excellent Animated Universe.

Yes, the excellent DC animation. For some reason, the cartoons were able to hire people with an outstanding knowledge of who the characters are, and a vision that has set the standard for DC story-telling. Many fans consider Kevin Conroy to be the definitive Batman. And Superman and Wonder Woman were never better than in the animated series. Given how well received that work was, it's bewildering that DC didn't bring Bruce Timm, et al to the table when trying to create a cinematic universe.

    Cyborg in the league is revisionist, but it's a revisionism that's been comic book cannon since 2011, and was first used way back in 1985 on the Superfriends cartoon.

Can a retcon even be considered canon? The change they made in 2011 was directly a result of DC eyeing a movie franchise. And they felt they needed a black person in there. And that's fine. But, why Cyborg? Why a hero who had never been a member, and who's inclusion would seem artificial? Why not Vixen? She was an actual member, and another woman, which would make Diana less of a token. Or better yet, why not the Martian Manhunter? He may be green in his natural form, but it could have been a powerful story to have him adopt a human identity that was part of a traditionally oppressed group to see how those who are different are treated on Earth. To me, Cyborg is just another example of lazy writing.

    Though I still can't watch Batman Returns, as I can't find any connection to the source material, sometimes you need to tell Tim Burton, "Stop."

You know, I actually really enjoyed the Burton take on Penguin. I usually hate changes to characters, but in the comics, Penguin was always a one-dimensional, gimmicky villain. Trick umbrellas? Bird themed crimes? Penguin may have been Batman's number two villain, but he was always on a par with Captain Boomerang to me. So, Burton giving him a better story worked for me (I'm aware of the irony). I also really like the cockney Penguin that was used in the Arkham City video games.

    The comic book Justice League did start as an All Star team (as Kurt Buseik said, comparing them to the Avengers as a championship team.) But it’s gone through a huge number of iterations as well.
    No, I don't want to see Justice League Detroit, the movie, I’m not that crazy.

And various iterations are fine, but not to start off. Everyone wants to see the classic League start the franchise. And it makes sense from a writing standpoint. A team created by heroic legends inspires second-tier heroes to be like them. Almost every hero in the DC universe aspires to League membership. And the audience would be inspired along with them.

If it had been me making the movie, the original members would've started the team, after having been introduced in their own movies. J'onn would adopt a black American identity to satisfy the diversity crowd. Hal, Barry, and Arthur would all be accurately portrayed, and would NOT be relegated to supporting status (like poor Cyclops in the X-Men franchise). The opening villain would have been Despero. Clark is vulnerable to telepathic attack, which would keep him from beating Despero single-handed. And the mind control angle could have given us the opportunity to see the League fighting each other, before confronting the villain. Subsequent films would bring in the Atom, Hawkman and Hawkgirl, and Green Arrow (all having been given their own films). Most importantly, the creative team from the Justice League animated series would've handled the writing. To this day, the dialogue from that show makes me smile. If a cartoon can give us such brilliant and emotionally fulfilling entertainment, then why settle for anything less from a movie?

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