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Subj: Re: Here is the thing, tho..
Posted: Sun Sep 21, 2008 at 04:14:11 am EDT
Reply Subj: Re: Here is the thing, tho..
Posted: Sat Sep 20, 2008 at 11:04:57 am EDT (Viewed 171 times)

> > But there is something magical to keep it at bay. Atlas and Hercules. At least as this background goes.
> If there's nothing in the comic about maFit'sgical power keeping the Earth intact, then it's not there, in my opinion, which makes the feat dubious.

You are still using real world physics.

Atlas is strong enough to suspend the Heavens upon his shoulders. So is Hercules.

Thats all. Like Superman, WW and Manhaunter are strong enough to move the Earth with a lasso, without the Earth crumbling apart.

> > What about the pre crisis fats that Superman had? You can say the same about any feat of absurd magnitude. Even post crisis when the trio moved the Earth. Why didnt it crumble itself with the pressure of being moved?
> Because Flash negated strain they were placing on the planet, as the comic explains and shows. Regarding pre-Crisis feats -- if anything was as absurd as holding up the universe while standing on Earth -- minus some force written in the comic that keeps the Earth intact, I would conclude that he didn't hold up the universe, either. Like I said, I can accept an enromous range of absurdity in comics -- palming a black hole, holding together tectonic plates, etc., but somethings are just too much for me. However, for the sake of battleboard argument, I'll accept it as a bona fide feat and add it to Hercules' "average" -- given it's a one-off feat, its impact on Herc's average is basically nil. Until it becomes common for him to bench universes, it's not a representative of his strength.

No one is saying that this is his average now, thats silly.

But "nil". Would you say that about Superman?

> > We cant really explain any of this, other than the feat itself looking good in fictional-comic book terms. And thats all it matters to me. I dont try to explain any of Hulk`s, or Superman`s feats either. They happen..because of the character`s power. Thats the reason writers use them.
> Okay.
> > Why?
> You opended the door: You brought up real world physics not applying; mass/weight is real world physics, too. If you say strucural integrity doesn't apply, I can say mass/weight doesn't, either.

I opened wich door? You brought it up.

When you bring real world physics in a comic book style feat, you are asking the impossible to be explained. You should know that by now.

> > Its something heavy in fantastical terms. Thats all you need to know.
> > This isent the first time we see a feat alike.
> I've never seen a feat like this -- nothing like standing on Earth and holding up the universe.

Tell that to Superboy who moved a whole galaxy worth of planets, with a single chain, without anything happening to the chain, or either planets.

> > Atlas is magic. Or better yet, his powers are naturally magical.
> Where in the comic does it say that Atlas and Hercules have the power to make the Earth strong enough to hold them up as they hold up the universe?

Jesus, rc. Why would you *need* to make the Earth strong enough for anything, when the point of the feat is to ilustrate how strong *someone* is?

The Earth is comic book strong since it doesnt blow up on any feat, no matter how over the top.

> >
> > "my shoulders belong to Zeus"
> Has nothing to do with whether he was literally benching the universe.

It got everything to do with it.

Im beginning to think that you are getting every excuse possible to not take it for what it is. Wich is your perrogative, f course.

Just dont act like you have never seen a ridiculous comic book feat.

> > > > In this land, if you are strong enougth, nothing happens. Not unless its the porpuse of the writer to happen. The ground doesnt fall just because Superman is stopping a falling building, and it should.
> > >
> > > Will it? Buildings crumble to the ground and don't fell the ground. However, for the sake of argument, I will say you are right here. But it is much less believable that a planet could bear the weight of a universe than the ground could a falling building, in my opinion.

> > >
> > > > Just my two cents.
> > >
> > > If you take this feat at face value, fine. It is extremely more far fetched than ground remaining intact when a character catches a falling building, in my oinion, thus it invites more scrutiny, in my opinion, and is far more dubious.
> > >
> > > There's a double standard here (not saying with you, as you haven't said anything on it): The Spectre is debunked -- rightfully, in my opinion -- as a lunar mass because the Moon didn't crack/fall/etc.; but Hercules' feat is not debunked as a universe- or planetary-level feat because the Earth didn't crack/fall/etc.
> Please address this.

I already did, in a response to another poster.

The "Moon didnt cracked bit" is mostly a mock, after one poster around started using the feat to ilustrate how the characters involved succeded in lifting Spectre, when we all saw he fell.

Apart from that, no one really cares if the Moon cracked or not. Its comic books. The Earth doesnt crack even when one feat is said to be powerful enough to destroy, so there is no reason to think that the Moon should either.

At the very least, if one thinks it should, then they should simply disregard every single feat like this.

As far as i am concerned, there is no double standart here.

> _rc

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