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Oliva


Member Since: Sat May 17, 2008
Posts: 2,456



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Captainidiot


Member Since: Tue Nov 18, 2014
Posts: 337


Assuming we are talking the real Thor, at his normal level of power:

I think Thor is taken aback by BA's first blow kill shot. Though it doesnt kill him, he is staggered. After a quick moment, Thor realizes what he is dealing with and takes off the restraints he normally puts on himself. Even giving that Thor's lightning doesnt affect BA much, Thor wins a brutal slugfest that puts BA down. BA has speed advantage, but Thor can compensate in reaction time. BA can win, but I say Thor wins 7 out of 10.

If we are talking Jane, then BA 10 out of 10. Not just because I hate Jane, but because he complete lack of warrior mentality and skill. BA kills her.


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Reverend Meteor


Member Since: Sat May 17, 2008
Posts: 10,560



This is not going to be one of those fights where one easily triumphs over the other.

This is one of those fights where one guy dies after hours of fighting and the other one is maimed for life.

Neither of these guys are chumps.





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UName


Member Since: Tue Mar 10, 2015
Posts: 523




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JesusFan


Member Since: Sat May 17, 2008
Posts: 18,184


All depends on just how much damage to BA the Hammer can do for Thor, for if it is a lot, he could still edge out, but if same as shown vrs Superman, same result, Goldilocks takes a nap!


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JesusFan


Member Since: Sat May 17, 2008
Posts: 18,184


BA as powerful as Superman, less vulnerable to magic, and goes for the kill....


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Primetime


Member Since: Tue Dec 29, 2009
Posts: 225


Black Adam has no more speed feats than Thor.


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motifian


Member Since: Sat Jun 10, 2017
Posts: 1,221



    Quote:
    Black Adam has no more speed feats than Thor.


Adam has fought Jay Garrick at Superspeed and has kept pace with him at near lightspeed on foot.


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Primetime


Member Since: Tue Dec 29, 2009
Posts: 225


And that is the one of roughly two, maybe three. Somewhat of a blitz on the Marvel Family and that is about the extent of it. And those are old. He doesn’t have many combat speed showings.


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Bk Ray

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Member Since: Sat May 17, 2008
Posts: 6,867



Normal posters have to spend the next 15 years explaining Thor didn't actually win.





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motifian


Member Since: Sat Jun 10, 2017
Posts: 1,221



    Quote:
    And that is the one of roughly two, maybe three. Somewhat of a blitz on the Marvel Family and that is about the extent of it. And those are old. He doesn’t have many combat speed showings.


What? Given how few his appearances are, they are not outliers.

Even in his few appearances, he is vastly above Thor in speed. I can't imagine Thor doing this.

https://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/11/111336/4209277-9215550386-34944.jpg


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Primetime


Member Since: Tue Dec 29, 2009
Posts: 225



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Marvelfan


Member Since: Tue Aug 15, 2017
Posts: 147


nt


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motifian


Member Since: Sat Jun 10, 2017
Posts: 1,221



    Quote:
    One or two combat speed feats out of almost 550 appearances are most definitely outliers.





Thor doesn't has those in 5000 appearances. None of your showings have Thor fighting a speedster like Flash at full on Superspeed.

Quicksilver has casually left entire Avengers team along with Thor like statue. As had Monica Ramebeu.


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Primetime


Member Since: Tue Dec 29, 2009
Posts: 225



    Quote:
    Thor doesn't has those in 5000 appearances. None of your showings have Thor fighting a speedster like Flash at full on Superspeed.


More like 2500 appearances. And they show him fighting Black Adam level speed.


    Quote:
    Quicksilver has casually left entire Avengers team along with Thor like statue. As had Monica Ramebeu.


That's a team. He catches Hermes who shows equal to Makkari.

http://i.imgur.com/2sqLTpj.jpg







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Bk Ray

Moderator

Member Since: Sat May 17, 2008
Posts: 6,867



wrong

https://www.ranker.com/list/superheroes-ranked-by-most-comic-book-appearances/ranker-comics


also, well done on finding a scene where Thor sneaks up on a speedster who isn't actually racing





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Primetime


Member Since: Tue Dec 29, 2009
Posts: 225




Posted with Mozilla 11.0 on Windows 7
Bk Ray

Moderator

Member Since: Sat May 17, 2008
Posts: 6,867



Batson went fist to Thor's hammer. Thor was able to sling a heavy piece of funfair machinery on him and Marvel decided to change into Billy.

Seeing this, Thor sacrificed his hammer in a desperate bid to prevent the lightning. It's an interesting take from the writers, where they obviously didn't want to show Thor ko'ing him.

In a sense, it shows Adam would be a greater foe. Teth Adam is the same size and Adam doesn't hold back. No tactical sense for him to change and Adam's temperament makes him a different kettle of fish. It's often remarked that his ferociousness can make him a match for several top tier heroes when combined with his speed and strength.

It's likely a fist fight wouldn't go Thor's way, especially now Thor has no hammer and only one arm. He is truly the one armed bandit.





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Primetime


Member Since: Tue Dec 29, 2009
Posts: 225


I doubt that Thor has appeared in an average of 10 comics every month since his creation. They are including animations, Ultimate Thor, etc. I would thus be equally wrong on Black Adam so lets say he has been in around 1200.


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Primetime


Member Since: Tue Dec 29, 2009
Posts: 225


The hammer is an established standard part of Thor's power-set.


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Bk Ray

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Member Since: Sat May 17, 2008
Posts: 6,867



I think I'll take their view thanks





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Bk Ray

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Member Since: Sat May 17, 2008
Posts: 6,867



but thanks for getting involved





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The Shuruku Demon


Member Since: Sun Jan 04, 2009
Posts: 10,457


It's an intriguing match-up, what Thor being the god of thunder, and Adam getting his power from lightning. I'm not sure Thor's lightning would have any special effect on Adam though, beyond what it can do by virtue of it's sheer power. As far as I know, Adam's powers are only activated/deactivated by Shazam bolts, not lightning from other sources. In DC VS. MARVEL, we saw that Thor could use Mjolnir to intercept a Shazam bolt, but I don't see him getting that opportunity against Adam, since Adam isn't in the habit of reverting to human form midfight (Billy only did so due to the rules stipulated by The Brothers).

So more likely than not, this'd be straight contest of power vs. power. And Thor could still win on those terms, but it'd be near 50/50 fight IMO. On the off-chance that Thor did manage to manipulate Adam's powers in some way though, that'd obviously tip the scales decidedly in his favour.




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Primetime


Member Since: Tue Dec 29, 2009
Posts: 225


Doesn't Bill typically defeat Adam?


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Primetime


Member Since: Tue Dec 29, 2009
Posts: 225


Makes more sense (you'll have to cut and paste):

http://marvel.wikia.com/wiki/Category:Thor_Odinson_(Earth-616)/Appearances


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The Shuruku Demon


Member Since: Sun Jan 04, 2009
Posts: 10,457


(Responding to both UName and PT here...)

Focusing on physical/muscular speed only (as opposed to flightspeed), Black Adam has been clocked at much higher speeds than Thor (at least Mach 500). There really shouldn't be any dispute about that. However, I don't see him owning Thor on that basis. Superman is likely even faster than Adam, and has way more super-speed showings, yet his speed wasn't a game-changer against Thor in JLA/Avengers. I don't think that was because Thor has comparable speed, I think it was because Superman doesn't tend to use super-speed much during fights, and when he does, it's usually only in short bursts. If guys like Superman and Black Adam fought at super-speed all the time, they'd wreck Thor, but in practice, it's written as a occasional-use power that wouldn't be a deciding factor in most fights.




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Bk Ray

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Member Since: Sat May 17, 2008
Posts: 6,867



I asked the same thing myself - why does Adam get so much more respect?

Adam DOES have better feats however, he's taken on multiple heroes, all down to his warrior training and ferocity. If you have any scans of clean wins from Billy, I would like to see them.





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The Shuruku Demon


Member Since: Sun Jan 04, 2009
Posts: 10,457



    Quote:
    Batson went fist to Thor's hammer. Thor was able to sling a heavy piece of funfair machinery on him and Marvel decided to change into Billy.

    Seeing this, Thor sacrificed his hammer in a desperate bid to prevent the lightning. It's an interesting take from the writers, where they obviously didn't want to show Thor ko'ing him.


Peter David said in an interview that he thought it would lame and implausible for characters who could potentially fight each other for a whole issue or more, to trounce each other in a few pages (and they couldn't spare more than a few pages for each fight, due to the nature of the book). It was apparently he who came up with the 1-second immobilisation rule (inspired by pins in wrestling), to allow fights to be ended relatively quickly without a clean KO. That doesn't mean he didn't think Thor could beat Billy cleanly eventually, but he certainly didn't want to show either being punched out quickly.


    Quote:
    In a sense, it shows Adam would be a greater foe. Teth Adam is the same size and Adam doesn't hold back. No tactical sense for him to change and Adam's temperament makes him a different kettle of fish. It's often remarked that his ferociousness can make him a match for several top tier heroes when combined with his speed and strength.


That cuts both ways, because I see no reason to believe Thor was going for the kill against Billy. Peter David (the guy who wrote that fight) established that Thor had always held back against the Hulk until HULK #440. I think Thor would be more comfortable going for the kill against Black Adam than the likes of Billy or Superman, since Adam doesn't have an innocent human inside him like the Hulk does, and Thor is from a culture where fighting to the death is relatively normal.


    Quote:
    It's likely a fist fight wouldn't go Thor's way, especially now Thor has no hammer and only one arm. He is truly the one armed bandit.


Yeah, I'd probably favour Adam over Unworthy Thor. He's much easier to disarm than classic Thor, in more than one sense.




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zvelf


Member Since: Sat May 17, 2008
Posts: 9,621


...Thor won with 27 votes to Black Adam's 12.

http://comicboards.com/php/show.php?msg=comicbattles-2008041014033200

http://comicboards.com/php/show.php?msg=comicbattles-2008041114272200

No conventional comic writer would ever write this fight as involving super speed to any notable degree, so bringing that aspect into it isn't relevant. My own opinion is that Thor and Adam are physically close enough in strength and durability that what makes the difference in this fight are other factors - namely Adam's true flight and Thor's versatility - Mjolnir, energy projection, energy manipulation especially of a mystical bent, weather control, and vortexes. Thor's greater versatility carries this fight for him. Also, Thor has generally fared well against folks with power sets similar to Adam's: Hyperion, Gladiator, Captain Marvel (Billy Batson), and Count Nefaria.






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The Shuruku Demon


Member Since: Sun Jan 04, 2009
Posts: 10,457



    Quote:
    I asked the same thing myself - why does Adam get so much more respect?

    Adam DOES have better feats however, he's taken on multiple heroes, all down to his warrior training and ferocity. If you have any scans of clean wins from Billy, I would like to see them.


I've read a fair bit of Captain Marvel's series and JSA, and I don't recall Billy straight up punching Adam out ever. Either their fights end inconclusively, or there's some kind of extenuating circumstance involved, like Billy managing to depower Adam by removing his Scarab necklace the first time they fought.




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Primetime


Member Since: Tue Dec 29, 2009
Posts: 225


That and there is another time when BA threatens a passenger jet in order to force Billy to stop fighting and leave. Up until then, it was a back and forth. So it seems that BA's aggressiveness has not given him any noticeable advantage over Billy in a clean fight.

Billy may have beaten him cleanly pre-crisis.


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