This is their fight from Superman vs. Darkseid: Apokolypse Now! No single top-tier character has ever beaten Thanos like Superman beats Darkseid here in a straightforward fair fight for a clean win with an admission of defeat.

https://comicvine.gamespot.com/squirrel-girl/4005-2488/forums/when-squirrel-girl-beated-thanos-377261/

Uatu: Yes, Squirrel Girl, with my cosmic senses I can confirm that that is, in fact, the one, true Thanos, and not a robot, clone, or simulacrum.

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Shortly after by the same writer:

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/C8QU0lUVwAEuhes.jpg

Attachments

Thanosclone.jpg (912 x 447)

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It's all a joke! It's not supposed to be taken seriously! If your battleboard evidence depends on Squirrel Girl showings, all you've done if fallen prey to Marvel writers making a joke out of you.

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Time and again Thanos has been defeated, with attempts to show he's not all that and then Starlin keeps writing in retcons, despite the fact it's a joke.

That's what is amusing. No one takes Squirrel Girl seriously, it's just funny how, an actual panel was added just to counter that.

It's not like we think the NYPD are herald level characters and that's how they captured Thanos.

But yes, Superman has beaten Darkseid and Squirrel Girl hasn't quite beat the original Thanos, so a more impressive showing from Superman. I am not trying to reduce your evidence that Superman is above Marvel top tiers here.

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Well, I was ready to throw up the flag quite honestly. Until I found this just now:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Squirrel_Girl

Squirrel Girl's defeat of Thanos is an ambiguous one. Uatu the Watcher was present at the battle and claimed Squirrel Girl defeated the genuine Thanos and not a clone or copy.[14] Thanos has since claimed he has perfected a means of creating clones of himself that could fool even "the most cosmic of beings." Adding to the ambiguity is the fact that the reveal comes from the mind of a clone whose memory had been altered.[She-Hulk vol. 2, #12-13]

Do I need to elaborate further on why your scan just lost its teeth?

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Which is why I was very careful to first ask you in a different thread if the story is canon regardless, and you said "I think Marvel is leaving that up to the reader."

I'm all about the canon, dude. It's the only way to have an agreed-upon set of interpretations, and even if comedy, bad writing, a joke, it stands. Deadpool breaks the 4th wall and I still consider it canon despite the intended joke.

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You're not all about the canon because in trying to argue Darkseid and Thanos are equals, you all but said that Darkseid would be an equal IF ONLY those darn Marvel canon retcons wouldn't keep getting in the way!




Well, if you want to take a joke seriously, that is, not treat it as a joke, then the joke's on you.

Your words: "You all but said." That's right, I didn't say it. Just pointing out how easy a retcon would fix everything to bring them in line. Dude, it could take years to establish a character as having a new power base. If Spider-Man suddenly lifts a mountain, people would reject it because he's only meant to have the proportionate strength of a spider. And if in the next issue, he lifted a 50 story building, people would still reject it. Nobody would reject Darkseid as suddenly comparable to Thanos, however, if a one-page retcon explained that the true Darkseid never fought beings as lowly as Superman, that he's been orchestrating his plans through avatars the whole time. That's all I was putting out there, take it for whatever point you think I was serving, even if just a mere lament but jab at Marvel for having lameness to perform continual Thanos mop-up duty.







Powerful taunt and slander tactics because you can't escape what you conceded.

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Here is another instance of Superman beating Darkseid with Darkseid again outright admitting his defeat in a fair fight.

In a third fight, Superman beats Darkseid again. He has a little help from Wonder Woman at the beginning.

nt

It's interesting that a hero/villain performs one amazing feat, or use a power they haven't used for 20+ years, and that automatically propels them to a high status despite scans and evidence to the contrary. I don't know what is worse, selective feat picking that has only been done once or twice 20, or more, years ago or ignoring evidence from scans or the lack thereof. We need to stop putting our favorite heroes/villains on pedestals and start putting them where they really belong. But it's evident that people never will because they would rather accuse others of cherry picking feats, when they don't, and being 'morally superior' when they aren't. I guess being honest and as fair as possible only opens one up to being the target of childish accusations and fault finding by those who insist on acting petty and childish. What happened to a good debate between two civil, mature, adults?

To be fair to Darkseid, Superman was amped by the power of the sun in this fight as he was so close to it. The closer Superman is to the sun, the more powerful he gets by the second. Still, it's a win and it's an impressive one. The only win against Darkseid I don't consider P.I.S.

It's interesting that a hero/villain performs one amazing feat, or use a power they haven't used for 20+ years, and that automatically propels them to a high status despite scans and evidence to the contrary. I don't know what is worse, selective feat picking that has only been done once or twice 20, or more, years ago or ignoring evidence from scans or the lack thereof. We need to stop putting our favorite heroes/villains on pedestals and start putting them where they really belong. But it's evident that people never will because they would rather accuse others of cherry picking feats, when they don't, and being 'morally superior' when they aren't. I guess being honest and as fair as possible only opens one up to being the target of childish accusations and fault finding by those who insist on acting petty and childish. What happened to a good debate between two civil, mature, adults?

I must’ve have angered you good which wasn’t my intention. Because I can’t help but feel you’re resorting to disingenuous tactics because this has a well known retcon. Are you not aware, or are you purposely trying to muddy things?

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Not seeing where my scan lost any teeth. The purposeful ambiguity wipes out the defeat. And the clone has Thanos’s memories, thus is remembering what Thanos remembers.

And then you actually resorted to Wikipedia.

First, I'm not angry whatsoever. I wasn't even thinking of you when I made these posts. I was thinking of someone else on this board who thinks that Darkseid is a skyfather or better in power level (everyone else here will know who I mean). Don't think too much of yourself now.

Also, if this instance was retconned, a claim that is ambiguous at best, DC has un-retconned it. It's a featured story in DC's recently released collection, Superman vs. Darkseid. Obviously if this wasn't really Darkseid in this story, then it shouldn't have been in a collection called "Superman vs. Darkseid," even making up about one third of the full volume.

Not sure how two retcons is “time and time again”. The third retcon didn’t even involve a defeat IIRC. Neither of the two loses involve straight up head to head defeats and Starlin himself has written Thanos being defeated. Starlin’s retcons were about characterization. He didn’t want a nihilistic Thanos anymore.

Dan Slott wrote Squirrel Girl defeating Thanos and he also wrote the retcon. So that was not Starlin’s doing, but rather a writer poking fun at Starlin and retconning his own story.

And since Superman struggled more against Thor than he did Darkseid in Apokolips Now, we can agree tha Thor is above DC top tiers.

I do agree that for drama's sake, for Darkseid to make sense as a character and a real threat, he should beat Superman. And when evaluating Darkseid's entire history and feats, I think he should also beat Superman, but most of the time, Superman gives him a very tough fight and has either won or stalemated Darkseid.

A clone who had false memories made the “retcon” statement. Hmm, what can go wrong.




Yeah, what’s wrong with that? I’m lazy. But I promise you they got it right.

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Okay, my apologies. It just seemed too coincidental with the dialogue from our other thread.

Maybe you’re not aware of the retcon, but that’s actually Desaad and there’s an issue where Darkseid asks him how many times he impersonated him, they’re standing on images that show the scenes in these scans.


http://static2.comicvine.com/uploads/scale_super/3/33308/1480122-darkseid173.jpg

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This is rather amusing. But yes, Thanos has been beaten like this before.

http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/13/132594/3490783-gl+%26+ss+ua+-+0044.jpg
http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/13/132594/3490784-gl+%26+ss+ua+-+0045.jpg
http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/13/132594/3490785-gl+%26+ss+ua+-+0046.jpg

Wait, that's even worse.

Darkseid stunned Superman with a simple backhand and Superman was amped by going to the sun as he knew he couldn't beat Darkseid on earth.

This is retconned as Desaad impersonating Darkseid.

You will again see how attacking Darkseid with his own omega beams weakens him considerably.

Well, Darkseid is a skyfather. And featuring in a TPB does not un-retcon the retcon done by the writer of the scene himself. John Byrne retconned it.

http://static2.comicvine.com/uploads/scale_super/3/33308/1480122-darkseid173.jpg

That's why it has been stated twice now.

http://s18.postimg.org/65vbezd55/The_Unbeatable_Squirrel_Girl_004_010.jpg

I guess this is another joke, huh?