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Bk Ray

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So, when he fought Winter Soldier, this was without the herb.

Does this make him above Cap now?





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    Quote:

    So, when he fought Winter Soldier, this was without the herb.


Do we know for certain it was without the herb?


    Quote:
    Does this make him above Cap now?





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Bk Ray

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Yeah, it was stated that only kings get the herb and then they had a ceremony where he then ate the herb.





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seeker


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    Quote:

    Yeah, it was stated that only kings get the herb and then they had a ceremony where he then ate the herb.


Interesting. I remember Bucky had the look of fear and concern when T'Challa clearly had the upper-hand in their fight.

But I suspect Cap always held back against Bucky because they were long-term best friends. The entire time Cap didn't believe all the alleged crimes against Bucky were true and was trying to get him professional help.

With that said, Cap would without a doubt be pushed to his limits fighting T'Challa IMHO.




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Man-Beast


Member Since: Wed Jul 09, 2014
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    Quote:

      Quote:

      Yeah, it was stated that only kings get the herb and then they had a ceremony where he then ate the herb.



    Quote:
    Interesting. I remember Bucky had the look of fear and concern when T'Challa clearly had the upper-hand in their fight.



    Quote:
    But I suspect Cap always held back against Bucky because they were long-term best friends. The entire time Cap didn't believe all the alleged crimes against Bucky were true and was trying to get him professional help.



    Quote:
    With that said, Cap would without a doubt be pushed to his limits fighting T'Challa IMHO.


I don't think Bucky would have stood long against an all-out Cap, because we just don't see Cap go all out. It's not his way. Hell, most of the time his weapon of choice is a SHIELD. And we see him use plenty of guns in his first movie, so its not like he doesn't know how.

I think this is the closest we've seen to an all-out Captain america:

https://youtu.be/rbMc8wbLwKk?t=62

The strength he's demonstrating here is pretty phenomenal. Those suits a not light, and he's not only lifting and throwing it, but briefly resisting its propulsion from the legs designed to move that suit of iron armor. He then beats Iron Man so severely that he cannot even react inside his armor - WITH HIS BARE HANDS.

We see BP and Cap fight a little in Civil War. Cap is mainly stalling which BP is out for absolute blood. Cap seems to handle himself well. IMO Cap is significantly higher than BP in his metahuman stats in the cinematic universe. However, BP's armor is the major wild card. It is such an absolutely insane advantage that it's hard to quantify. Through all the terrible beatings he receives I don't recall him ever being harmed under the armor (like Iron Man does occasionally).

As demonstrated in the BP movie, unless you can disable the armor in some way, I'm not even sure BP *can* be defeated. It is just that ridiculously overpowered.



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We need to hear from you more on here. \(wink\)


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Bk Ray

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BC


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Bk Ray

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Man-Beast


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Bk Ray

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Man-Beast


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Bk Ray

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Primetime


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Fifthchild


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    Quote:

    So, when he fought Winter Soldier, this was without the herb.



    Quote:
    Does this make him above Cap now?


As said elsewhere in the thread I think we can safely assume he had the herb in Civil War.

At any rate, I would put BP, Cap and Bucky all at about the same level. BP without the suit does seem to be somewhat overwhelmed by Bucky in Civil war but its a pretty brief sequence.

Basically I think whoever needs to look slightly better to fit the plot - i.e. Bucky in the beginning of Winter Soldier where he is the scary villain will be shown as having an edge. Otherwise they are more or less equals.





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Bk Ray

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BP was outrunning cars in Civil War. No way he could do that as a human.





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Rehzon


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Yeah. He took a couple hits from Bucky, where one was enough to drop those security men. How fast and how high he got up to in front of Bucky, after getting up from the bionic punch to the chest. The kick that sends Bucky flying, and T'Challa's upstairs drop to the floor with ease.



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    Quote:
    At any rate, I would put BP, Cap and Bucky all at about the same level. BP without the suit does seem to be somewhat overwhelmed by Bucky in Civil war but its a pretty brief sequence.


I remember it the other way around. BP was beating Bucky without the suit. Admittingly I'm going strictly by memory here but I remember being impressed by that...






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Bk Ray

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T'Challa does seem to do well against him, it's difficult as Bucky is clearly trying to escape and has just went through Tony Stark (been hit by a repulsor blast) then took down Agent 13 and then Black Widow.





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    Quote:

    T'Challa does seem to do well against him, it's difficult as Bucky is clearly trying to escape and has just went through Tony Stark (been hit by a repulsor blast) then took down Agent 13 and then Black Widow.


True, you're right. Bucky primary goal was escape so he was being defensive the whole time. Although it still seems to me BP would still have the advantage because he was out for blood.

I don't remember but didn't BP and Cap tangle briefly too?








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Fifthchild


Member Since: Sat May 17, 2008
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    Quote:

      Quote:
      At any rate, I would put BP, Cap and Bucky all at about the same level. BP without the suit does seem to be somewhat overwhelmed by Bucky in Civil war but its a pretty brief sequence.



    Quote:
    I remember it the other way around. BP was beating Bucky without the suit. Admittingly I'm going strictly by memory here but I remember being impressed by that...


I dont see it that way - the fight does end with T'challa getting a good kick in which sets up Bucky for a fall but Bucky apparently just walks off. Its a little more even than I remember but all in all I would say Bucky had a slight edge:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nIlzqDbxJCQ





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