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Author
Knight


Member Since: Sat May 17, 2008



Would it be a repeat of the season 1 big bad? If Zoom does turn out to be Earth-2 Dr. Wells, what would you think?





It's interesting that a hero/villain performs one amazing feat, or use a power they haven't used for 20+ years, and that automatically propels them to a high status despite scans and evidence to the contrary. I don't know what is worse, selective feat picking that has only been done once or twice 20, or more, years ago or ignoring evidence from scans or the lack thereof. We need to stop putting our favorite heroes/villains on pedestals and start putting them where they really belong. But it's evident that people never will because they would rather accuse others of cherry picking feats, when they don't, and being 'morally superior' when they aren't. I guess being honest and as fair as possible only opens one up to being the target of childish accusations and fault finding by those who insist on acting petty and childish. What happened to a good debate between two civil, mature, adults?
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Iron Man Unit 007





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Knight


Member Since: Sat May 17, 2008





It's interesting that a hero/villain performs one amazing feat, or use a power they haven't used for 20+ years, and that automatically propels them to a high status despite scans and evidence to the contrary. I don't know what is worse, selective feat picking that has only been done once or twice 20, or more, years ago or ignoring evidence from scans or the lack thereof. We need to stop putting our favorite heroes/villains on pedestals and start putting them where they really belong. But it's evident that people never will because they would rather accuse others of cherry picking feats, when they don't, and being 'morally superior' when they aren't. I guess being honest and as fair as possible only opens one up to being the target of childish accusations and fault finding by those who insist on acting petty and childish. What happened to a good debate between two civil, mature, adults?
Posted with Mozilla 11.0 on Windows 7
Iron Man Unit 007

Moderator

Member Since: Sat May 17, 2008
Posts: 6,147



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Reverend Meteor





    Quote:

    Would it be a repeat of the season 1 big bad? If Zoom does turn out to be Earth-2 Dr. Wells, what would you think?


I don't think I would want to watch the show any more.

Recycling the big bad for 2 consecutive seasons is just bad storytelling. On some shows that might work if it goes along with the premise but this is a show showcasing multiple villains...surely they can find a different big bad from season to season.


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JesusFan


Member Since: Sat May 17, 2008


That would be really bad, as Wells as RF worked too well, and should make Zoom someone else!

How about barry from e2?


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JesusFan


Member Since: Sat May 17, 2008


Could be cool to have Barry e2 dad as Zoom though< "barry, i am your father"

Or maybe that is what happened to eddie when he got sucked up into the Wormhole?>


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Daveym 

Moderator

Location: Lancashire
Member Since: Sat May 17, 2008



It is already a rehash of series 1 if he isn't or is Zoom, so it doesn't matter. The series is holding my attention and the characterisation and acting is close to excellent, this all that matters for me.

It does strike me that while Earth-2 is an alternate earth with a different history and peoples, and therefore anything is possible storywise, the plot similarities might be suggestive of the truth of things.
Consider that on earth-1 Harrison Wells' life appears much the same as his earth-2 self, up until he is killed and replaced by the time-travelling Eobard Thawne who needs to recreate The Flash and will use Wells' planned Particle Accelerator to instigate an 'accident' that will do it.
On Earth-2 we are appearing to see what might have happened if Earth-2 Harrison Wells had lived. He builds a career and his Particle Accelerator explodes... but is this a true accident or did Wells intentionally trigger the event as Thawne did? If it is no accident then Wells has a plan for doing it, and how then does he know of the Multiverse?

So considering the story so far it is quite possible that whatever the earth Harrison Wells is destined for villainy. He fixated on Jay Garrick as an enemy, and there is history between the two, he is manipulative and intuitively assesses Barry Allens potential and knows how to exploit him in a similar was Wells/Thawne did - is it coincience that Zoom appears to share this gift for manipulation and using people to further his ends? Is it not noteworthy that Zoom appears not to be human, nor speak like a normal person? How could he end up this way, unless his appearance is deceiving and the truth much more complex than it appears?

I can believe that Zoom is some facet of Wells himself yes, but I can also believe this is an allegory of Doctor Frankenstein and his monster. Wells created Zoom, and he is living with that...



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Jesusfan




What if wells created Zoom from his world barry then, or maybe there was a wally west who became Zoom?

What if they need to find reverse Flash and bring him somehow back to defeat Zoom?


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Reverend Meteor





    Quote:

    It is already a rehash of series 1 if he isn't or is Zoom, so it doesn't matter. The series is holding my attention and the characterisation and acting is close to excellent, this all that matters for me.



    Quote:
    It does strike me that while Earth-2 is an alternate earth with a different history and peoples, and therefore anything is possible storywise, the plot similarities might be suggestive of the truth of things.
    Consider that on earth-1 Harrison Wells' life appears much the same as his earth-2 self, up until he is killed and replaced by the time-travelling Eobard Thawne who needs to recreate The Flash and will use Wells' planned Particle Accelerator to instigate an 'accident' that will do it.
    On Earth-2 we are appearing to see what might have happened if Earth-2 Harrison Wells had lived. He builds a career and his Particle Accelerator explodes... but is this a true accident or did Wells intentionally trigger the event as Thawne did? If it is no accident then Wells has a plan for doing it, and how then does he know of the Multiverse?



    Quote:
    So considering the story so far it is quite possible that whatever the earth Harrison Wells is destined for villainy. He fixated on Jay Garrick as an enemy, and there is history between the two, he is manipulative and intuitively assesses Barry Allens potential and knows how to exploit him in a similar was Wells/Thawne did - is it coincience that Zoom appears to share this gift for manipulation and using people to further his ends? Is it not noteworthy that Zoom appears not to be human, nor speak like a normal person? How could he end up this way, unless his appearance is deceiving and the truth much more complex than it appears?



    Quote:
    I can believe that Zoom is some facet of Wells himself yes, but I can also believe this is an allegory of Doctor Frankenstein and his monster. Wells created Zoom, and he is living with that...


My nutty theory for a season now. Vandal Savage (who will be on Legends of Tomorrow) is behind the metahumans. He's not controlling the time travel of other characters but in every reality we've seen his plan was in place and was either sped up or slowed down. Since Eobard never knew anything about Vandal he didn't know he was having an effect on his design.

Like the comics I think Vandal has descendants. Some know who he is some don't. My personal belief is that Savage has 2 daughters..Felicity Smoak and Tess Morgan (Harrison's wife). Felicity doesn't know he's her father (or if she knows her father it's just an identity he used until he cast it aside). Tess was always in on the plan.

In Eobard's timeline (Earth-0?) Tess was instrumental in the founding of Star Labs. Tess was said to be smarter than the real Harrison. So my thinking is that in Eobard's timeline Vandal Savage scheduled for metahumans to spring forth in 2020 (which is when Eobard's Flash got his powers).

When Eobard came to Earth-1 he killed Tess and Harrison but stole their Star Labs idea. He sped the plan up (Vandals thoughts on the matter would be interesting...is his plan working better than he hoped for or is his timetable being disrupted). Instead of metahumans springing forth in 2020 they came about in 2013.

Earth-2 Harrison set up Star Labs in 1991. In Earth-1 Harrison and Tess were still working on the idea in 2000. Something sped up the debut of Star Labs. Yet for all we know Earth-2 didn't get an influx of metahumans until a year before Earth-1 (Barry's had his powers for about a year...Jay has had them for 2 years). Again I think Vandal and (Earth-2) Tess have a time table they're working on.

There have been spoilers that Arrow villain Damien Darhk of all people will be on Legends of Tomorrow. So that makes me think...Damien probably has a boss. Damien's already an immortalish sorcerer...he wouldn't work for just anybody. Vandals's a big enough bad guy for another big bad to work for.

So my thinking is Vandal has been pulling strings on both Arrow and Flash. He hasn't controlled everything (he didn't control Eobard). But he had a plan to create metahumans that Eobard unwittingly hijacked. Other versions of him on Earth-2 and Eobard's timeline were working toward similar goals (not in tandem). Vandal arranged for Damien to have Andy Diggle killed to put John Diggle in the position to be a part of Arrow's team. Vandal is working from a knowledge of the future and he's been pushing numerous chess pieces into position to bring about some sort of outcome. And if Felicity gets killed off on Arrow...well her father is immortal...she'll get better. Felicity being Green Arrow Flash and Atom's mutual friend may even be something Vandal wants.


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