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Gamma Ra


Member Since: Sat May 17, 2008
Posts: 9,282




His run kept going left, it never went right... It left me feeling not right.






He's... A Misunderstood MONSTER! An INCREDIBLE force! He's ASTONISHING! That's why you don't comprehend him! And because of his...RAMPAGING, the Hater will not tolerate him SAVAGE, INDESTRUCTIBLE, nor his being IMMORTAL!!! Watch out for that Gamma Ray-Burst...The WORLD BREAKER!!!"Only the Hulk could have attempted it! Only the Hulk would have been capable of it! Only the Hulk could have done it!"- Tales To Astonish #063"There is no way to measure his strength! There is nothing he cannot do!"- Tales To Astonish #073"That something -- anything -- could grab hold of an energy field should be IMPOSSIBLE! But the Hulk grabs hold just the same!"- The Incredible Hulk #242"Hulk can do ANYTHING!!! Hulk is mind over matter, mind over energy, mind over mind"- Gamma Ra the Assassin aka Lord Smash'emall - Faithful Member of The Church of Hulk
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Quantum


Member Since: Sun Dec 21, 2008
Posts: 2,295


How do you mean?




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Gamma Ra


Member Since: Sat May 17, 2008
Posts: 9,282





He's... A Misunderstood MONSTER! An INCREDIBLE force! He's ASTONISHING! That's why you don't comprehend him! And because of his...RAMPAGING, the Hater will not tolerate him SAVAGE, INDESTRUCTIBLE, nor his being IMMORTAL!!! Watch out for that Gamma Ray-Burst...The WORLD BREAKER!!!"Only the Hulk could have attempted it! Only the Hulk would have been capable of it! Only the Hulk could have done it!"- Tales To Astonish #063"There is no way to measure his strength! There is nothing he cannot do!"- Tales To Astonish #073"That something -- anything -- could grab hold of an energy field should be IMPOSSIBLE! But the Hulk grabs hold just the same!"- The Incredible Hulk #242"Hulk can do ANYTHING!!! Hulk is mind over matter, mind over energy, mind over mind"- Gamma Ra the Assassin aka Lord Smash'emall - Faithful Member of The Church of Hulk
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Immodicus


Member Since: Wed Jun 24, 2020



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Gamma Ra


Member Since: Sat May 17, 2008
Posts: 9,282





He's... A Misunderstood MONSTER! An INCREDIBLE force! He's ASTONISHING! That's why you don't comprehend him! And because of his...RAMPAGING, the Hater will not tolerate him SAVAGE, INDESTRUCTIBLE, nor his being IMMORTAL!!! Watch out for that Gamma Ray-Burst...The WORLD BREAKER!!!"Only the Hulk could have attempted it! Only the Hulk would have been capable of it! Only the Hulk could have done it!"- Tales To Astonish #063"There is no way to measure his strength! There is nothing he cannot do!"- Tales To Astonish #073"That something -- anything -- could grab hold of an energy field should be IMPOSSIBLE! But the Hulk grabs hold just the same!"- The Incredible Hulk #242"Hulk can do ANYTHING!!! Hulk is mind over matter, mind over energy, mind over mind"- Gamma Ra the Assassin aka Lord Smash'emall - Faithful Member of The Church of Hulk
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Immodicus


Member Since: Wed Jun 24, 2020



Posted with Google Chrome 96.0.4664.45 on Windows 10
Gamma Ra


Member Since: Sat May 17, 2008
Posts: 9,282





He's... A Misunderstood MONSTER! An INCREDIBLE force! He's ASTONISHING! That's why you don't comprehend him! And because of his...RAMPAGING, the Hater will not tolerate him SAVAGE, INDESTRUCTIBLE, nor his being IMMORTAL!!! Watch out for that Gamma Ray-Burst...The WORLD BREAKER!!!"Only the Hulk could have attempted it! Only the Hulk would have been capable of it! Only the Hulk could have done it!"- Tales To Astonish #063"There is no way to measure his strength! There is nothing he cannot do!"- Tales To Astonish #073"That something -- anything -- could grab hold of an energy field should be IMPOSSIBLE! But the Hulk grabs hold just the same!"- The Incredible Hulk #242"Hulk can do ANYTHING!!! Hulk is mind over matter, mind over energy, mind over mind"- Gamma Ra the Assassin aka Lord Smash'emall - Faithful Member of The Church of Hulk
Posted with Mozilla Firefox 94.0 on Windows 10
Gamma Ra


Member Since: Sat May 17, 2008
Posts: 9,282





He's... A Misunderstood MONSTER! An INCREDIBLE force! He's ASTONISHING! That's why you don't comprehend him! And because of his...RAMPAGING, the Hater will not tolerate him SAVAGE, INDESTRUCTIBLE, nor his being IMMORTAL!!! Watch out for that Gamma Ray-Burst...The WORLD BREAKER!!!"Only the Hulk could have attempted it! Only the Hulk would have been capable of it! Only the Hulk could have done it!"- Tales To Astonish #063"There is no way to measure his strength! There is nothing he cannot do!"- Tales To Astonish #073"That something -- anything -- could grab hold of an energy field should be IMPOSSIBLE! But the Hulk grabs hold just the same!"- The Incredible Hulk #242"Hulk can do ANYTHING!!! Hulk is mind over matter, mind over energy, mind over mind"- Gamma Ra the Assassin aka Lord Smash'emall - Faithful Member of The Church of Hulk
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Immodicus


Member Since: Wed Jun 24, 2020


That is correct in terms of accepted human science.   
My point is that why would beings like Eternity, Galactus and the Celestials accept human terminology?  

If we look at it from a larger sense of cosmic, meaning: 
1aof or relating to the cosmos, the extraterrestrial vastness, or the universe in contrast to the earth alonecosmic radiation
bof, relating to, or concerned with abstract spiritual or metaphysicalcosmic wisdom
2characterized by greatness especially in extent, intensity, or comprehensivenesscosmic thinkera book of cosmic significance
Which is inline with how Marvel has historically used the term "cosmic power, "Power Cosmic", "cosmic energy" or even "cosmic ray" and I think it qualifies Ewing's choice as consistent with Marvel tradition.   That's my point.  

-----------------------------------------------------
As far as the Higher beings in the MU, I'm sure most of them, though
termed cosmic, use other forms of energy as well including mystical.
Beings like FF, Captain Marvel and the U-Foes use cosmic while Silver Surfer channels it, they differ from those Higher entity forms.
-----------------------------------------------------

Mystical energy is usually depicted as distinct from cosmic energy in Marvel, though they can overlap.

I also view Surfer as sort of a miniaturized cosmic being given that he was granted a tiny fraction of Galactus' own "cosmic" essence which grants him the ability to utilize any type of energy (except maybe magical) and control over the fundamental forces.    



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Gamma Ra


Member Since: Sat May 17, 2008
Posts: 9,282





He's... A Misunderstood MONSTER! An INCREDIBLE force! He's ASTONISHING! That's why you don't comprehend him! And because of his...RAMPAGING, the Hater will not tolerate him SAVAGE, INDESTRUCTIBLE, nor his being IMMORTAL!!! Watch out for that Gamma Ray-Burst...The WORLD BREAKER!!!"Only the Hulk could have attempted it! Only the Hulk would have been capable of it! Only the Hulk could have done it!"- Tales To Astonish #063"There is no way to measure his strength! There is nothing he cannot do!"- Tales To Astonish #073"That something -- anything -- could grab hold of an energy field should be IMPOSSIBLE! But the Hulk grabs hold just the same!"- The Incredible Hulk #242"Hulk can do ANYTHING!!! Hulk is mind over matter, mind over energy, mind over mind"- Gamma Ra the Assassin aka Lord Smash'emall - Faithful Member of The Church of Hulk
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Immodicus


Member Since: Wed Jun 24, 2020


I'm not reaching at all as that is exactly how Marvel has historically used the term "cosmic".   

If cosmic simply referred to highly energized interstellar protons moving at near light speed it wouldn't give Marvel's cosmic energy the ability to manipulate souls, time, gravity, gamma energy, etc.  

Marvel CLEARLY uses "cosmic" in its classical sense, not in the sense of Hess' cosmic rays.  

------------------------------------
Here's a definition for you...

Gamma rays have the smallest wavelengths and the most energy of any wave in the electromagnetic spectrum. They are produced by the hottest and most energetic objects in the universe, such as neutron stars and pulsars, supernova explosions, and regions around black holes.

All these energies, cosmic and gamma, exist outside of earth's atmosphere.
------------------------------------

As I've shown I am well aware of what our definition of a cosmic ray is.  I am also aware of what a gamma ray is.  

However, why would Victor Hess' arbitrary word selection matter to a metaphysical being older than time?    

Hess called his rays "cosmic" because simply because they were not of earth.    That's it.  

If you doubt this look up the history of scientific debate in the early 1900s revolving around the source of atmospheric electricity.  
Many thought it was caused  by radiation emitted from the earth but Hess proved the radiation came from outside of the atmosphere hence the decision to call them "cosmic" -- meaning of the universe. 

Hess could have very easily called his discovery extraterrestrial rays and it would have had zero impact on the classical definition of cosmic.   

FYI, gamma rays were discovered in 1903 by studying radiation emitted by radium.  A terrestrial source.   
The discovery of extraterrestrial gamma rays came later.  

-----------------------------------------
And again, as far as energies are concerned, Marvelly written, only gamma and Ghost Riders have been said to be unlimited or boundless. Give me an instant of a cosmic being being said to have no limit.
-----------------------------------------

Seriously?  Many, many times.  

An easy example off of the top of my head is that Celestials have been described by Kubik as "trans-infinite" i.e. operating on a higher level of infinity than their own level of infinite power.  
Kubik then went on to name the Celestials as only one set of the "great powers of the universe" which also included Eternity, Galactus, Living Tribunal and the usual assortment of cosmic beings who also presumably operate on a similar "higher infinity". 

I would definitely categorize trans-infinite as unlimited.  
Perhaps even more unlimited than unlimited.  

 






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Gamma Ra


Member Since: Sat May 17, 2008
Posts: 9,282





He's... A Misunderstood MONSTER! An INCREDIBLE force! He's ASTONISHING! That's why you don't comprehend him! And because of his...RAMPAGING, the Hater will not tolerate him SAVAGE, INDESTRUCTIBLE, nor his being IMMORTAL!!! Watch out for that Gamma Ray-Burst...The WORLD BREAKER!!!"Only the Hulk could have attempted it! Only the Hulk would have been capable of it! Only the Hulk could have done it!"- Tales To Astonish #063"There is no way to measure his strength! There is nothing he cannot do!"- Tales To Astonish #073"That something -- anything -- could grab hold of an energy field should be IMPOSSIBLE! But the Hulk grabs hold just the same!"- The Incredible Hulk #242"Hulk can do ANYTHING!!! Hulk is mind over matter, mind over energy, mind over mind"- Gamma Ra the Assassin aka Lord Smash'emall - Faithful Member of The Church of Hulk
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Immodicus


Member Since: Wed Jun 24, 2020



Posted with Google Chrome 96.0.4664.45 on Windows 10
Gamma Ra


Member Since: Sat May 17, 2008
Posts: 9,282





He's... A Misunderstood MONSTER! An INCREDIBLE force! He's ASTONISHING! That's why you don't comprehend him! And because of his...RAMPAGING, the Hater will not tolerate him SAVAGE, INDESTRUCTIBLE, nor his being IMMORTAL!!! Watch out for that Gamma Ray-Burst...The WORLD BREAKER!!!"Only the Hulk could have attempted it! Only the Hulk would have been capable of it! Only the Hulk could have done it!"- Tales To Astonish #063"There is no way to measure his strength! There is nothing he cannot do!"- Tales To Astonish #073"That something -- anything -- could grab hold of an energy field should be IMPOSSIBLE! But the Hulk grabs hold just the same!"- The Incredible Hulk #242"Hulk can do ANYTHING!!! Hulk is mind over matter, mind over energy, mind over mind"- Gamma Ra the Assassin aka Lord Smash'emall - Faithful Member of The Church of Hulk
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Immodicus


Member Since: Wed Jun 24, 2020



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Gamma Ra


Member Since: Sat May 17, 2008
Posts: 9,282


Again, you are the one that bought up the fact that in 1912 Victor Hess coined the term "Cosmic rays". I'm simply saying cosmic by definition means the universe. In said universe i.e. cosmos there are many Ray's, gamma Ray's are the highest form of them


    Quote:
    What I’m saying is that “cosmic” in Marvel is largely used in the classical sense and not always (or even usually) referring specifically to cosmic rays.

Yes they are. In most of the comics, cosmic and gamma Ray's pose the same threat to everyone as they do in the real world. The results are only fictionalized to a minor few characters giving them super powers.


    Quote:
    You keep sticking on this comparison between cosmic and gamma rays but I’m arguing that “cosmic” has a larger and older meaning than cosmic rays specifically.
    Marvel writers know this and use the term accordingly.


True, the term cosmic is older than gamma in terms of Ray's, but the point I'm making is that gamma is more powerful force. That's regardless to when it was discovered.


    Quote:
    Power Cosmic - cosmic is being used in the classical sense
    Cosmic entity/being - cosmic is being used in the classical sense
    Fantastic Four’s original cosmic rays - is referring to actual cosmic rays



    Quote:
    Just for reference:



    Quote:
    cosmic adjective
    cos·​mic | \ ˈkäz-mik



    Quote:
    Definition of cosmic
    1. a: of or relating to the cosmos, the extraterrestrial vastness, or the universe in contrast to the earth alone
    Example:
    cosmic radiation

    b: of, relating to, or concerned with abstract spiritual or metaphysical ideas
    Example:
    cosmic wisdom



    Quote:
    2. characterized by greatness especially in extent, intensity, or comprehensiveness



    Quote:
    Example:
    a cosmic thinker
    a book of cosmic significance
    the power cosmic

Gamma by science today is listed by as  being the most powerful form of cosmic rays. The fact just is gamma is the superior force.








He's... A Misunderstood MONSTER! An INCREDIBLE force! He's ASTONISHING! That's why you don't comprehend him! And because of his...RAMPAGING, the Hater will not tolerate him SAVAGE, INDESTRUCTIBLE, nor his being IMMORTAL!!! Watch out for that Gamma Ray-Burst...The WORLD BREAKER!!!"Only the Hulk could have attempted it! Only the Hulk would have been capable of it! Only the Hulk could have done it!"- Tales To Astonish #063"There is no way to measure his strength! There is nothing he cannot do!"- Tales To Astonish #073"That something -- anything -- could grab hold of an energy field should be IMPOSSIBLE! But the Hulk grabs hold just the same!"- The Incredible Hulk #242"Hulk can do ANYTHING!!! Hulk is mind over matter, mind over energy, mind over mind"- Gamma Ra the Assassin aka Lord Smash'emall - Faithful Member of The Church of Hulk
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Immodicus


Member Since: Wed Jun 24, 2020



No, cosmic in the classical sense means vast, universal in scope…cosmic in the classical sense is greater than gamma radiation alone because gamma is only one aspect of a greater cosmic landscape.

If we’re referring specifically to cosmic rays vs gamma rays then yes gamma rays have more energy.

Cosmic does not equal cosmic rays in Marvel terminology, it can but it is an incorrect assumption to assume is always does.





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Gamma Ra


Member Since: Sat May 17, 2008
Posts: 9,282




    Quote:
    No, cosmic in the classical sense means vast, universal in scope…cosmic in the classical sense is greater than gamma radiation alone because gamma is only one aspect of a greater cosmic landscape.



    Quote:
    If we’re referring specifically to cosmic rays vs gamma rays then yes gamma rays have more energy.



    Quote:
    Cosmic does not equal cosmic rays in Marvel terminology, it can but it is an incorrect assumption to assume is always does.


I didn't say that. I stated that cosmos means the universe, and cosmic rays are part of the electromagnetic spectrum.


    Quote:









He's... A Misunderstood MONSTER! An INCREDIBLE force! He's ASTONISHING! That's why you don't comprehend him! And because of his...RAMPAGING, the Hater will not tolerate him SAVAGE, INDESTRUCTIBLE, nor his being IMMORTAL!!! Watch out for that Gamma Ray-Burst...The WORLD BREAKER!!!"Only the Hulk could have attempted it! Only the Hulk would have been capable of it! Only the Hulk could have done it!"- Tales To Astonish #063"There is no way to measure his strength! There is nothing he cannot do!"- Tales To Astonish #073"That something -- anything -- could grab hold of an energy field should be IMPOSSIBLE! But the Hulk grabs hold just the same!"- The Incredible Hulk #242"Hulk can do ANYTHING!!! Hulk is mind over matter, mind over energy, mind over mind"- Gamma Ra the Assassin aka Lord Smash'emall - Faithful Member of The Church of Hulk
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Marv


Member Since: Sat Jan 24, 2015
Posts: 7,790



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Nate

Moderator

Member Since: Sat May 17, 2008


I want to go back and reread it from the beginning. But my feeling is that Ewings run doesn’t really do much for the character aside from the horror aspects of it being pretty cool to see. I don’t get the sense that either banner or Hulk really had much of a character arc throughout or that there was a solid story being told throughout the entire run.


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Gamma Ra


Member Since: Sat May 17, 2008
Posts: 9,282




    Quote:
    I want to go back and reread it from the beginning. But my feeling is that Ewings run doesn’t really do much for the character aside from the horror aspects of it being pretty cool to see. I don’t get the sense that either banner or Hulk really had much of a character arc throughout or that there was a solid story being told throughout the entire run.


Ewing's run is indeed solid; as far as story goes; there's definitely a beginning, middle and end. Some of his ideas didn't quite get meat on their bones, like Hulk taking over the base and his plans against humanity. This is why I thought Ewing would be on the book at least a few more years to tell his tale. The story started to get monotone and he seemed to lose focus. But all in all it was complete. He seemed to be the one that took Hulk back to three distinct personalities.





He's... A Misunderstood MONSTER! An INCREDIBLE force! He's ASTONISHING! That's why you don't comprehend him! And because of his...RAMPAGING, the Hater will not tolerate him SAVAGE, INDESTRUCTIBLE, nor his being IMMORTAL!!! Watch out for that Gamma Ray-Burst...The WORLD BREAKER!!!"Only the Hulk could have attempted it! Only the Hulk would have been capable of it! Only the Hulk could have done it!"- Tales To Astonish #063"There is no way to measure his strength! There is nothing he cannot do!"- Tales To Astonish #073"That something -- anything -- could grab hold of an energy field should be IMPOSSIBLE! But the Hulk grabs hold just the same!"- The Incredible Hulk #242"Hulk can do ANYTHING!!! Hulk is mind over matter, mind over energy, mind over mind"- Gamma Ra the Assassin aka Lord Smash'emall - Faithful Member of The Church of Hulk
Posted with Mozilla Firefox 94.0
Gamma Ra


Member Since: Sat May 17, 2008
Posts: 9,282





He's... A Misunderstood MONSTER! An INCREDIBLE force! He's ASTONISHING! That's why you don't comprehend him! And because of his...RAMPAGING, the Hater will not tolerate him SAVAGE, INDESTRUCTIBLE, nor his being IMMORTAL!!! Watch out for that Gamma Ray-Burst...The WORLD BREAKER!!!"Only the Hulk could have attempted it! Only the Hulk would have been capable of it! Only the Hulk could have done it!"- Tales To Astonish #063"There is no way to measure his strength! There is nothing he cannot do!"- Tales To Astonish #073"That something -- anything -- could grab hold of an energy field should be IMPOSSIBLE! But the Hulk grabs hold just the same!"- The Incredible Hulk #242"Hulk can do ANYTHING!!! Hulk is mind over matter, mind over energy, mind over mind"- Gamma Ra the Assassin aka Lord Smash'emall - Faithful Member of The Church of Hulk
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paolo2143


Member Since: Thu Oct 26, 2017



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Gamma Ra


Member Since: Sat May 17, 2008
Posts: 9,282


As I've mentioned a few times in my posts to Immodicus, that the science in Marvel Comics is based on real world terminology. Even though effects to characters are dramatically fictionalized at times. But Gamma is such a superior force, that Stan Lee himself said it gives Hulk an unlimited strength potential. He did not say this about cosmic beings. Silver Surfer had to once absorb Hulk's gamma radiation in order to escape Galactus' barrier he used to imprison Surfer on earth. He didn't look for another cosmic being, he looked for Hulk because he possesses the Superior power. Case closed!






He's... A Misunderstood MONSTER! An INCREDIBLE force! He's ASTONISHING! That's why you don't comprehend him! And because of his...RAMPAGING, the Hater will not tolerate him SAVAGE, INDESTRUCTIBLE, nor his being IMMORTAL!!! Watch out for that Gamma Ray-Burst...The WORLD BREAKER!!!"Only the Hulk could have attempted it! Only the Hulk would have been capable of it! Only the Hulk could have done it!"- Tales To Astonish #063"There is no way to measure his strength! There is nothing he cannot do!"- Tales To Astonish #073"That something -- anything -- could grab hold of an energy field should be IMPOSSIBLE! But the Hulk grabs hold just the same!"- The Incredible Hulk #242"Hulk can do ANYTHING!!! Hulk is mind over matter, mind over energy, mind over mind"- Gamma Ra the Assassin aka Lord Smash'emall - Faithful Member of The Church of Hulk
Posted with Mozilla Firefox 94.0 on Windows 10
Immodicus


Member Since: Wed Jun 24, 2020



Posted with Google Chrome 96.0.4664.45 on Windows 10
Gamma Ra


Member Since: Sat May 17, 2008
Posts: 9,282





He's... A Misunderstood MONSTER! An INCREDIBLE force! He's ASTONISHING! That's why you don't comprehend him! And because of his...RAMPAGING, the Hater will not tolerate him SAVAGE, INDESTRUCTIBLE, nor his being IMMORTAL!!! Watch out for that Gamma Ray-Burst...The WORLD BREAKER!!!"Only the Hulk could have attempted it! Only the Hulk would have been capable of it! Only the Hulk could have done it!"- Tales To Astonish #063"There is no way to measure his strength! There is nothing he cannot do!"- Tales To Astonish #073"That something -- anything -- could grab hold of an energy field should be IMPOSSIBLE! But the Hulk grabs hold just the same!"- The Incredible Hulk #242"Hulk can do ANYTHING!!! Hulk is mind over matter, mind over energy, mind over mind"- Gamma Ra the Assassin aka Lord Smash'emall - Faithful Member of The Church of Hulk
Posted with Mozilla Firefox 94.0 on Windows 10
Immodicus


Member Since: Wed Jun 24, 2020



Posted with Google Chrome 96.0.4664.45 on Windows 10
Gamma Ra


Member Since: Sat May 17, 2008
Posts: 9,282





He's... A Misunderstood MONSTER! An INCREDIBLE force! He's ASTONISHING! That's why you don't comprehend him! And because of his...RAMPAGING, the Hater will not tolerate him SAVAGE, INDESTRUCTIBLE, nor his being IMMORTAL!!! Watch out for that Gamma Ray-Burst...The WORLD BREAKER!!!"Only the Hulk could have attempted it! Only the Hulk would have been capable of it! Only the Hulk could have done it!"- Tales To Astonish #063"There is no way to measure his strength! There is nothing he cannot do!"- Tales To Astonish #073"That something -- anything -- could grab hold of an energy field should be IMPOSSIBLE! But the Hulk grabs hold just the same!"- The Incredible Hulk #242"Hulk can do ANYTHING!!! Hulk is mind over matter, mind over energy, mind over mind"- Gamma Ra the Assassin aka Lord Smash'emall - Faithful Member of The Church of Hulk
Posted with Mozilla Firefox 94.0 on Windows 10

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