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zeus


Location: Plano, IL
Member Since: Sat May 17, 2008
Posts: 563


Hi All,

I'm slowly filling in the gaps in my collection of the original run of Defenders, and I recently picked up #111. Defenders #111 attempts to resolve a thread from the Six Fingered Hand storyline, where it's stated that Hellcat is Satan's daughter.

In Defenders #111 Satan shows up while Hellcat is looking for her dad. He first appears in the guise of Nicholas Eblis. He turns into Satan who tortures Hellcat briefly, then explains how the underworld works and gives her a pep talk. He admires Hellcat and appreciates that she made his son (Hellstorm) fall in love.

Eblis shows up a year later in a Marvel Fanfare story featuring Man-Thing (vol 1 #9, I think...). In that story Eblis is gathering souls for his demonic boss, but ends up losing the souls and getting punished by his boss.

SO, I'm left wondering what it all means. Is Elbis a "catch all" identity that any demon uses? That doesn't feel right.

It's possible that Eblis really is Satan, and in the Marvel Fanfare story he pretended to be subserviant to another demon, but it seems more likely to me that Eblis is some other demon who was manipulating Hellcat's search for her dad for some reason we never learn.

Anyone happen to know these stories well enough to concur or disagree?


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The Black Guardian

Moderator

Location: Paragon City, RI
Member Since: Sat May 17, 2008
Posts: 26,433


Nicholas Eblis is just a lackey that channeled his boss, Satan.




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Grey Gargoyle


Member Since: Sat May 17, 2008
Posts: 17,839


The Marvel Appendix & SuperMegaMonkey might help you with this topic. \:\-\)

http://www.marvunapp.com/Appendix3/eblisnicholis.htm
http://www.marvunapp.com/Appendix/mardukkurios.htm
http://www.supermegamonkey.net/chronocomic/entries/marvel_fanfare_9.shtml
http://www.supermegamonkey.net/chronocomic/entries/defenders_111.shtml

Eblis was created by J.M. DeMatteis.

In Defenders #111, the same writer had Satan say "Although their forms are different and dominions are distinct and individual, all of them emanate from me! I am consciously within them -- 'tho even they do not know it!".

In stories written by J.M. DeMatteis, "Satan" is a similar concept to the current "One Below All" in stories written by Al Ewing.

In the 1990s, the father of Daimon Hellstrom was revealed, by another writer (Warren Ellis), as one specific Hell-Lord (Marduk Kurios).


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JesusFan


Member Since: Sat May 17, 2008
Posts: 23,540


There has never really been a Satan in Marvel, as the closest thing to Him would be Mephisto, who was not actually Satan, but a demonic being mimicking him!..

he seemed to have been shown in Ghost Rider, as when "Jesus" appeared to help Johnny Blaze out, but later retconned to being a fake Jesus and not real satan!


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JesusFan


Member Since: Sat May 17, 2008
Posts: 23,540


I thought that Marvel bever really had a Satan, but those such as Mephisto claiming to be such?


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JesusFan


Member Since: Sat May 17, 2008
Posts: 23,540


The real satan though, or another like a Mephisto just claiming to be Him?


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zeus


Location: Plano, IL
Member Since: Sat May 17, 2008
Posts: 563


This Satan, explained to Hellcat that he wasn't the Satan from the Bible, and added the caveat that he wasn't sure if that Satan actually exists.

He claimed to be tapped in to the collective Human unconscious, and that all other demons like Mephisto were aspects of him.

The problem, of course, is that this is all coming from the mouth of a demon, so who knows how credible any of it is...


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JesusFan


Member Since: Sat May 17, 2008
Posts: 23,540


I thought Mephisto and other demons were the direct result of the Infinity Being killing itself off?


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zeus


Location: Plano, IL
Member Since: Sat May 17, 2008
Posts: 563


The double edged sword of having demons and devils interacting with mortals is that we can never trust they are telling the truth.

All someone like Hellcat can do is shrug their shoulders and hope they really made it out of there sane and alive.


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Grey Gargoyle


Member Since: Sat May 17, 2008
Posts: 17,839



    Quote:

    I thought that Marvel bever really had a Satan, but those such as Mephisto claiming to be such?


It depends on the writer ... In the 1970s, Marvel books were inspired by horror movies and, in some cases, Satan was supposed to be Satan.

Since then, the Marvel Handbooks have approached the topic from a different angle : all devils are liars.

Frankly, it really depends on the writer.


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