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America's Captain 

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- so I replaced my Busiek/Perez Avengers banner early. Thanks, Iron Man Unit 007, for the Highlander banner! Now: got any more thread topics to keep us talking?

Meanwhile, if anyone actually does want to talk about the Busiek/Perez Avengers, feel free to start a thread about it!






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Iron Man Unit 007


Member Since: Thu Oct 20, 2011
Posts: 3,239


Yes the pilot episode had its flaws, no arguing that.

The S1 episode with Joan Jett showing up as a psycho-femme fatale immortal was awful

Constantly leaving Tessa at home while he goes off to fight the villain of the week got old quick.

Bad Day in Building A was an episode where Duncan got to show off more of his other skills and to face off against non-immortal enemies without giving away his secret. A step in the right direction.

Halfway through Season 1, the episode where Grayson and Darius were brought in and Duncan shifted his operations to Europe was where the show started improving.

Episodes of Season 1 to watch due to being pretty good or also expanding on parts of the mythos:

ep 2: Innocent Man: shows Duncan's code of honor and that he will go out of his way to save an innocent. Also a funny tagline at the end of the fight "In the future I'll remember to leave your friends in peace." Duncan's response "What future?" and beheads him with a vengeance

Ep 7: Mountain Men

Ep 8: Revenge is Sweet, Duncan tries to run away before the quickening over takes him showing that there is no escape from it.

Ep 9: the Sea Witch: shows that proximity counts even if you don't do the beheading

Ep 11: a bit weak but does confirm that all immortals are foundlings/orphans

Ep 13: Band of Brothers. Grayson and Darius are introduced into the series along with the concept that Grayson being an "ancient" immortal (almost 2000 years old) could be an automatic win against Macleod who is only 400. Also the concept of Light and Dark Quickenings is mentioned

Ep 15: immortal Xavier St Cloud (Roland Gift of Fine Young Cannibals) plays the latest immortal villain. He escapes Duncan after being "disarmed" and returns in Season 2. He would also appear in later episodes in flashbacks. This ep shows that immortals do NOT regrow lost body parts........though it also did not show if they could reattach the lost part and hope it regenerates back in place.

Ep 18" Lady and the Tiger: first appearance of Amanda, 'Nuff said! \:\)
(Also shows that the Quickening goes to the one that does the beheading, not necessarily the fighting)

Ep 22: the season finale: The Hunters we also get Hugh Fitzscairn played by Roger Daltry of THE WHO. Also the loss of a good character, but that was due to the actor dying.

https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PL07AA8809A1C65EED


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Iron Man Unit 007


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Ep 1: The Watchers, concludes the story from the end of Season 1. Also a character from this will return later. Also we learn from some dialogue that in this timeline Connor has still faced and slain The Kurgan, it just wasn't the final Gathering.

Ep 3: Turnabout: Joe tries to befriend Duncan despite being a Watcher and Duncan's trust of the Watcher's isn't all that great. Also an interesting immortal villain. Somewhat weak episode but still watchable.

Ep 4: The Darkness: major event occurs.

Ep 5: Sheena Easton plays the villain of the week ;\) Also there is a new immortal in the game

Ep 6: no immortal villain of the week. Still an interesting episode and the friendship of Joe and Duncan continues to evolve.

Ep 7: Amanda returns! \:\) She is clearly the "catwoman" of the series.

Ep 9: interesting episode, no immortal of the week. But an interesting twist on racism and the Hunters

Ep 10: decent plot, but the villain of the week is the late ROWDY RODDY PIPER!!!!!!! Excellent job with the Quickening!

Ep 12: good character moments for Duncan and Richie

Ep 14 and 15: Unholy Alliance. Xavier St Cloud is back and teamed with an unusual ally to break the rules of the Game and claim the Prize....
Joe and Duncan's friendship is sorely tested with at one point Duncan warning Joe "Next time I see you it will be the last!"

Ep 17: Duncan's code of honor and solemn promise made to the villain of the week long ago is sorely tested.

Ep 18: Amanda episode! Also hints that magic/artifacts may exist in the Highlander universe

Ep 20: decent episode. Immortal Constantine was brought in as an attempt to replace Darius, but this character wasn't seen again in the series.

Ep 21 and 22: Season finale, Horton vs Duncan

Also the intro sequence to the episodes is greatly improved from Season 1

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7WbZZHb5LBU&list=PL0F441D4BC7D7CEDE




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Iron Man Unit 007


Member Since: Thu Oct 20, 2011
Posts: 3,239


Ep 1: We see Duncan's code of honor in action again and the origins of Duncan's katana

Ep 2: confirmation that even if your immortality is NOT activated you cannot have kids. Also Duncan goes on a vendetta to fulfill and old oath of revenge against the villain of the week.

Ep 4: Duncan has another old promise to fulfill against the villain of the week and asks Amanda for her help. Another Amanda episode, yay! \:\)

Ep 5: a new immortal arises and is used as a patsy or pawn if you prefer against Macleod by one of his old enemies.

Ep 6: an old immortal friend of Duncan who is also a master swordsman is insane/weary and a junkie from all the centuries.

Ep 7: an interesting twist on the villain of the week

Ep 9: another interesting twist on the villain of the week

Ep 10: someone catches Duncan on camera taking down an immortal....

Ep 12: excellent character episode for Joe and the Watchers

Ep 13: can a leopard really change its spots?

Ep 14: Kalas is introduced into the series and does he hate Duncan!

Ep 15: Kalas is still on the attack, determined to ruin Duncan's life before killing him.

Ep 16: Kalas seeks the location and head of the oldest known living immortal METHOS for the massive power boost he would need to take down Macleod and virtually all other immortals. Methos is the replacement for Darius and is 5000+ years old. He is also proof that despite a vast age difference that being an ancient immortal is not an auto-win for his fights.

Ep 17: a competent and capable female warrior immortal is in this episode. A rare occurrence in the series, I'm afraid.

Ep 18: interesting choice for villain of the week, good character development for Richie.

Ep 19: Duncan's girlfriend is pregnant??? Also Duncan vs. an immortal Nazi villain of the week!

Ep 21 and 22, Season finale. Kalas is back and is about to blow the whistle on Watchers and Immortals to the media and hence the world. Final fight vs Duncan on the Eiffel Tower....the world's biggest lighting rod!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JiJ0bMaTtuQ&list=PLFC8186BB77606413


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Iron Man Unit 007


Member Since: Thu Oct 20, 2011
Posts: 3,239



Ep 1: Homeland. Duncan is compelled to return to the Highlands of SCOTLAND, claim the ancient clan Macleod sword and face against Kanwulf the Viking!


Ep 2: good character episode

Ep 4: Richie has a major character moment as Duncan deals with the villain of the week.

Ep 5: light hearted episode but Amanda is in it!

Ep 6: the origin of immortal Kenny and Amanda is back again!

Ep 7: old enemy of Duncan traps him. Amanda must save him and Joe must again risk breaking the rules of the Watchers.

Ep 10: interesting concept for villain of the week and Duncan's code of chivalry and honor is tested. Methos returns.

Ep 13 and 14: The Dark Quickening!

Ep 16: followup story about the crystals that Amanda's teacher had in Season 2. Amanda vs Methos??

Ep 21 and 22: season finale, Joe is on trial for breaking the Watcher's rule, death is the penalty!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W_1-qBlgikU&list=PLE77BF0F0097CF20A


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Iron Man Unit 007


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Ep 1: magic and prophecies are the name of the day in this episode as Duncan learns he is a "chosen one"

Ep 2: Richie vs Duncan????

Ep 6: Amanda is back! Also never have Duncan be the victim of a bomb blast! It makes him angry!

Ep 8: interesting take on the villain of the week. Also a Watcher legend about the Holy Ground rule is revealed

Ep 11 and 12: the 99th and 100th episodes of the series! THE FOUR HORSEMEN RIDE AGAIN!!! And guess who is one of them?

Ep 16: Duncan is reminded to not judge lest he be judged!

ep 17: Lord Byron is an immortal??

Ep 18: Season finale. This storyline concludes in Season 6.....I honestly did not like this storyline or the villain behind it all.....but there is a major character moment in this.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q4CkSEIfLxY&list=PL0C22738406B1B0D4


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Iron Man Unit 007


Member Since: Thu Oct 20, 2011
Posts: 3,239


Honestly......none except the last 2 episodes.

This was the final season, and Adrian Paul was feeling a bit weary and wanted to move on. Some episdoes brought in new female immortal characters as tests to see who could get the spin off series. Amanda got the spin off instead and it only went one season.....it was that bad.

A Methos Chronicles spin off would have been far, far better!

Ep 1 and 2: wraps the horrid story began at the end of last season. If you are curious go watch it. While not as bad as Highlander 5 the Source, this was still a weak story.

Ep 12 and 13: Duncan is still depressed from the end of Season 5 and is sick of friends being used against him by the villains of the week. So Duncan is prepared to end it all, but will he instead learn that....It's a Wonderful Life after all?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fyG0e4pgtfo&list=PL121386665F7D5FE6


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Iron Man Unit 007


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Meant to spawn more movies with Duncan.

It failed.

Villain concept: he is barely older then Duncan, but he doesn't care about the rules and has a posse with him to wear down targets so that he takes their heads. He has a vendetta with Connor and has been making his life miserable for centuries. He also has well over 600 kills according to the Watchers and is close the infamous total of 666 by the time he and Duncan clash.

Bah! Duncan took down a few ancient immortals in the series (including 2 of the Horsemen), the quality of the quickening is more important then the quantity!

Three versions exist of this movie, theatrical, cable and DVD. All suffer from different editing and bad editing as well as weak story and weak acting.

The movie also gives us the fan service of Connor vs Duncan, winner take all......ugh.

It would have been far better to have a powerful villain kill Connor and Duncan must avenge his mentor and clansman

If you watch Endgame I would encourage you to watch the flashback parts, Connor talking to Duncan when Kell confronts them both and reveals he is the villain, then watch Connor vs Duncan, then Duncan vs Kell. Skip all other moments in the movie.

Adrian Paul as I recall was not thrilled at all with how this movie turned out and wanted out. He apparently had to be convinced to return for Highlander 5: The Source which was originally going to be 4 new immortal characters questing for the origins of immortals, but Duncan, Methos and Joe were put into the movie.

HL5 was so awful it skipped theaters and premiered on the SyFy channel... it was hoped this movie would launch a trilogy. All cast and crew in it are now of the opinion it was bad dream and best forgotten.

Never watch HL5: The Source, it is far worse then HL2, 3 or 4.



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Iron Man Unit 007


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The Quickening is the name of the energy within immortals that transfers to another immortal when one is beheaded.

1. If no immortal is around when an immortal loses their head, the quickening energy is said to return to the source....

2. When an immortal takes another immortals head they get their quickening energy. If other immortals are close by they do not receive the power. It only goes to the one that does the beheading. This is the real reason fights are one on one.

3. The quickening energy does not affect mortals but the pyrotechnics and explosions of nearby objects can. \:\)

4. Grass, trees and other flammable objects can burn, electric devices that are online can be overloaded and conductible materials and alloys can channel the energy.

5. If an immortal loses their head by another means, such as being chewed up by a boat engine (season 1), the power will go to an immortal if they are close by.

6. no immortal escapes the quickening. Duncan tried to run away in an episode but the power still came to him.

7. The energy is the life force, essence, memories and knowledge of an immortal. When taken in, the immortal must assimilate the energy into themselves.

8. Light Quickening: a rare occurence where the quickening of a good or saintly immortal changes the other immortal into a good person.
Darius the monk is an example of this.

9. Dark Quickening: take in too much evil from a beheaded immortal and you will overload and turn evil as the evil personas you have absorbed are too strong to assimilate. This occurred to Duncan in Season 4 and Methos had to take him to a place where he could face his inner evils and cleanse himself. A later comic mini-series retconned things so that when Connor took down the Kurgan it was also a Dark Quickening and Connor had to undergo a similar internal cleansing.

10. The PRIZE: said to be the sum total of all the knowledge and energies of all immortals combined into one immortal for good or evil.

It is said if one like Kurgan gets it that mankind is doomed to an eternity of Darkness. However despite what happened with Connor at the end of the first movie, in the revised continuity created by the series no one really knows the nature of the prize other then it is stated as the combined power of all immortals. What affect it would have on the recipient and Earth itself is not known.



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Superman's Pal

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My entry to the franchise was Highlander 2 which I saw in the theater. I had never heard of the first one, but my Dad and I saw the ad on TV, we were into sci-fi so we thought why not? I didn't really understand it, I didn't hate it. It had a few funny and/or cool bits and a lot of cheese.

So later, in college, I had some theater class where the teacher decided we should watch and discuss a movie, and some guy lobbied for Highlander so that's what we did. I enjoyed it a lot more than the second, it's still got a cheese factor but I see why it became a cult classic. I kept expecting it to end in a way that would lead into the second, explaining how these Earthmen could become aliens by the second film, but it didn't happen. Later I learned the reasoning behind the sequel.

So then Highlander: The Gathering showed up at the video store. We would soon learn that it was a pilot for a new series. It was nice to see Connor again, Duncan didn't really do it for me. Of course I remembered Adrian Paul from War of the Worlds and a lot of other stuff over the years. Highlander is undoubtedly the pinnacle of his career. But The Gathering, with cheesetastic Richard Moll and budget lightning effects, it wasnt enough to gwt me to try the series.

Then the 3rd theatrical flick came out. Again they ignore Connor getting the Prize. The problem is they made a series out of a movie that was all about the final battle of its mythology. You can't really follow it. Van Peebles doing his best Kurgan gravel-voice. I say skip this one and watch Lambert and Van Peebles in Gunmen instead. Now that is a cult classic.

I didnt see the 4th film until much later, I was on a completist kick. Mediocre, seems like an episode. So after killing Heather, killing Brenda (twice), now they have to dig up Rachel and kill her too? Doesn't pay to be a lady friend of Connor MacLeod. I might have just watched for the Edge appearance, I was big into wrestling back then.

Eventually I got the Director's Cut of the first movie and the Renegade Edition of 2 (and the Special Edition, natch). I really appreciated what a good visual director Russell Mulchahy is. Even 2, it's so well staged with big sets and locations. I like the behind the scenes video where they talked about needing a train track running through a downtown area for one setpiece. Instead of laying track in an existing downtown, they found ab existing track out in the sticks and built an entire town around it. This movie must have been leaking money, no wonder the insurance company took over production. Then there's the "Gone With the Wind" scene where they keep zooming out to reveal hundreds, no thousands of victims in the UV burn ward. And it was cut for time in the theatrical release. What a testament to wasted potential this movie was. Too bad it was all at the service of such a crappy plot and script. I rewatch it almost as much as the first. It's the worst movie I've ever loved.

I can't believe that Highlander 2 wasn't the movie that derailed Mulchahy's career, but The Shadow, which was a decent movie.

I did see Highlander 5. What a mistake.



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The Black Guardian

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Eh. I thought the Joan Jett episode was slightly better than the one where a doctor learns Duncan's secret and kidnaps him for experiments. I don't think it was significantly worse than many of that first season either.


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Iron Man Unit 007


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Original continuity: first movie, Connor wins the prize: THE END

Second Continuity: HL 1 and HL 2

Third Continuity: HL1 but revised so that yes Connor took down Kurgan but it wasn't the final gathering for the Prize, and the TV series plus its spin off.

Fourth Continuity: HL 1 and HL 3, though HL3 occurred when Season 4 of the series started it did not link to the series.

Fifth Continuity: The third continuity listed above plus HL 4 and HL 5.

The third continuity is I believe the one that is considered canon, HL 4 and especially 5 were so negatively received that both may well be disregarded. I know for a fact that HL5 definitely is.


Now continuity 6 is in the works with a reboot of the original movie.


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Iron Man Unit 007


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Well to be honest the full powers and capabilities of the immortals are largely unexplored.

1. Immortality: activated when they experience their first death. Their body regenerates back to life and the quickening within them is activated.
However any scars or crippling injuries they received prior to first death remain with them.

Example: if a pre-immortal gets a scar on their face before their first death, that scar is with them after they become immortal. However the wounds that caused their first death do heal when they come back.


2. Rapid regeneration: cut an immortal and they will bleed but quickly begin to heal. the deeper the cut the longer it takes to heal. Slash an immortal in the gut in a sword fight as Duncan did many times to stop them, and they will double over in pain and the wound slowly heals leaving them wide open for the beheading.

Special note: throat/neck wounds do NOT full heal as this is close to being beheaded. A side effect of this injury is that the immortals voice tends to change, example: Kurgan and Kalas

Also an immortal can receive a wound that would kill a mortal and temporarily "die" as their body shuts down to heal. This leaves the immortal dangerously vulnerable unless they are on holy ground, but if a mortal is hunting them then the "penalty" for killing on holy ground does not apply if a mortal does the killing.

3. Proximity sense: the full range of this power is not known but when two or more immortals get within proximity they sense each other's presence. However this does not automatically tell them where the other immortal is, nor does it ever tell WHO the other immortal is. It could be a friend....or not. Also immortals cannot sense mortals but they can sense those destined to be immortal.

4. Occasional ability to find another immortal even if they are across the world. Somehow in the first movie, Kurgan knew which immortals were in New York and also somehow knew the name of the one that Connor struck down in the beginning of the movie. In the third movie, one of Kane's goons somehow traveled the world seeking Connor and somehow knew where to find him.

However this ability is inconsistent and should be considered more of a plot device as the series showed many times an immortal using detective work and treachery to find another immortal's location such as when Kalas was seeking Methos.

5. Special mental powers, some immortals have somehow shown special mental powers such as the power to cast illusions. HL 3 had this and so did a villain of the week in the series. Other immortals such as Cassandra have wielded magic. This is rare as immortals tend to rely in the skills they learn over the years they live and their sword arm.

6. Near perfect memory recollection: immortals tend to remember all aspects of their lives, Methos is 5000+ and is rumored to not remember his first death and quickening but this is rumor.


7. Holy Ground: not a power, exactly. But something about Holy Ground is sanctuary for all immortals be they good or evil. Churches, cemeteries, indian burial grounds are all examples of holy ground. It should be noted that immortals can spar and train on holy ground, but they are forbidden to go for the kill.

HL 3: Kane fights Connor in a Buddhist monastery and went for the kill. Connor blocks the attack but his sword shattered and then the statue of Buddha glowed ominously and both decided to flee.

When Horton confronted Duncan in a crypt in season 2, Duncan tried to kill him but Horton reminded him of Holy Ground and fled. However it is NOT KNOWN if the no killing rule applies to an immortal killing a mortal on holy ground. in Season 3 when an immortal Nazi confronted Duncan's friends on Holy Ground, he intimidated one into fleeing off Holy Ground only to be killed by the villain once he was off Holy Ground. Even the Kurgan wouldn't fight on Holy Ground.

Mortals can kill immortals on Holy Ground, go watch the last episode of Season 1 to see this.

Season 5 episode Little Tin God revealed a legend that two immortals fought in a temple, right before Pompeii was destroyed......an apocryphal tale but one that should be listened to.


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Superman's Pal

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    Quote:
    Original continuity: first movie, Connor wins the prize: THE END



    Quote:
    Second Continuity: HL 1 and HL 2

Ironically Highlander 2 for all its alien hogwash was the only followup to acknowledge than Connor won the Prize and became mortal. I thought a much simpler explanation for a new batch of immortals would have simply been new ones were activated in the 40 years since Connor won the Prize rather than they came from another planet, or an ancient race before recorded time that lived in a crashed spaceship and had machine guns.


    Quote:
    Third Continuity: HL1 but revised so that yes Connor took down Kurgan but it wasn't the final gathering for the Prize, and the TV series plus its spin off.



    Quote:
    Fourth Continuity: HL 1 and HL 3, though HL3 occurred when Season 4 of the series started it did not link to the series.



    Quote:
    Fifth Continuity: The third continuity listed above plus HL 4 and HL 5.

So H3 doesn't link to anything? The series probably didn't contradict it but H4, which was tied to the series did, because didn't it state that Connor went into Sanctuary directly after fighting the Kurgan?


    Quote:
    The third continuity is I believe the one that is considered canon, HL 4 and especially 5 were so negatively received that both may well be disregarded. I know for a fact that HL5 definitely is.



    Quote:

    Now continuity 6 is in the works with a reboot of the original movie.

Ugh. Everything must be rebooted.



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Superman's Pal

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    Quote:
    3. Proximity sense: the full range of this power is not known but when two or more immortals get within proximity they sense each other's presence. However this does not automatically tell them where the other immortal is, nor does it ever tell WHO the other immortal is. It could be a friend....or not. Also immortals cannot sense mortals but they can sense those destined to be immortal.

But in the first movie before the clan battle, Kurgan says "there is one among them named Connor, leave him to me" so obviously his sense told him which member of the MacLeod clan was his target, and led him straight to him.


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America's Captain 

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    Quote:

    Ironically Highlander 2 for all its alien hogwash was the only followup to acknowledge than Connor won the Prize and became mortal. I thought a much simpler explanation for a new batch of immortals would have simply been new ones were activated in the 40 years since Connor won the Prize rather than they came from another planet, or an ancient race before recorded time that lived in a crashed spaceship and had machine guns.


Connor himself could have activated the new Immortals. It could have been a privilege of winning the Prize.

Or else Connor's eventual death could have activated the new Immortals.

But what of Duncan? Simple. The Highlander TV series would have been prequel to the first movie. Thus Connor would not have yet faced the Kurgan. The final episode of the TV series could have shown the Kurgan taking Duncan's head. They could have filmed this episode very early on and stuck it in a can for when the series announced its final season. This would have served to intenify even further the vengeance Connor would extract from the Kurgan in the film.

And then there could have been a follow-up series that chronicled the adventures of the next generation of Immortals.






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Iron Man Unit 007


Member Since: Thu Oct 20, 2011
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Kurgan could have sensed a potential immortal in the clan and investigated to see who it was before the battle

Or we just chalk it up to the long range ability to sense specific immortal's locations at times.

Season 1 ep 2 of the TV series showed Duncan and Tessa walking along a road to go visit and old friend of his. Duncan suddenly collapsed to the ground as if struck and when he stood up he senses that his friend was just beheaded.

Also Highlander 4 Endgame: after Duncan absorbed Connor's power and was restin and mourning we see Kell and it looks like he has sensed the end of his enemy.

It might be that other immortals at times can sense the passing of another immortal if they are in range however this would be an apparently random thing as at the end of season 3, neither Amanda or Methos knew Duncan had won the fight until he emerged from the Eiffel Tower.

Inconsistencies abound in this franchise.


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Iron Man Unit 007


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It was meant to feature Connor and pick up From the movies and move forward, again the premise appears to have been that Connor took down Kurgan but it wasn't the final gathering, just two old enemies settling scores for good.

Lambert didn't want to do TV, however.

Adrian Paul was cast and it was apparently his idea that they make a new Macleod since fans would already compare him to Lambert it would be better to be a new character then a version of Connor.

Someone else was cast as Connor for the pilot but back out and Lambert was persuaded to be in the pilot but they could only afford him for a few days.




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Iron Man Unit 007


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This movie was basically a rewritten first movie.

It did not acknowledge HL 2, in fact some dialogue in it erases HL2 from continuity and set up a new timeline.

HL2: Brenda died from UV radiation burns. HL3: she was killed in a car crash in Scotland and Connor apparently walked away without a scratch despite apparently being mortal. However I can attest from experience that sometimes sheer luck enables one to not be injured in a car crash.

HL 3 came out when season 4 of the series was starting as I recall or about to start. The movie was 1994 and I think Season 4 began to air in 1995.....

HL 3 does NOT link at all to the TV series and the series does not acknowledge it either. There is no mention by Duncan or the Watchers that Connor had adopted a kid or returned to dispatch Kane.

HL 3 did acknowledge that Connor thought he was the last immortal and that the Prize was his until Kane and his cronies emerged from stasis in the cave. It did not mention him being mortal at all, only that he thought he had the Prize but Kane's awakening either revealed he didn't have it, only a major power boost, or the Prize left him.

he goes back to NY City where the Gathering occurred to prepare and we get a brief revisit of the plot of his mortal ID being a murder suspect. Kane somehow tracks him there, they clash and eventually Kane loses.

Connor now apparently does have the Prize including the power of illusion casting and retires to live with his new girl and adopted kid. IT does not indicate if he is mortal or not.

Also the ominious lighting strike at the end leaves it open that maybe there are more immortals still....?

Anyway this movie is overall best ignored along with HL 2 and especially HL5


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Iron Man Unit 007


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HL 1 establishes that the immortals do not know the origins of their existence.


HL 2: they are aliens from Planet Zeist......ugh. The Renegade Director cut omits Zeist and they are apparently time displaced from the distant past or another dimension.......still UGH.


HL 3: no orgin data, HL 2 is disregarded.


HL 4: no origin data.

HL 5: anything revealed about their origins in his disaster of a movie is to be ignored.

HL The TV series: no direct revelations of their origins.

We DO however get confirmation in the series that all immortals being as foundlings/orphans. Their parents if they had any are unknown.....

Also there is the Holy Ground rule.....


I speculated a long time ago and I still stick with this is that The Game is actually a battle between Heaven and Hell.

The immortals are foundlings/orphans because they are either created from nothingness by both sides in the war and cast to Earth to be raised and live until their power is activated. OR: they are spirits cast out from each realm to fight in the war with their memories of being from those realms deleted.

Holy Ground is agreed by both heaven and hell as sanctuary for any immortal and that the killing of one by another on Holy Ground will have extreme cosmic penalties....

The good immortals fight for heaven and the evil for hell, even if none of them realize it. Then there are the immortals whose alignment is more on the fence and subject to change.


Amanda was a thieving cat burglar whose moral code was questionable until Duncan straightened her out.

Richie was a street punk and likely would be an evil immortal had Duncan not given him a chance and some training and act as a moral compass of sorts before he became immortal

Methos: the man is 5000+ years old. While he is for the most part on the side of good, he's had his dark days only to renounce them. But he isn't all high and mighty judgemental like Duncan would be. Methos knows he really can't take the mortal high ground due to his time as one of the Horsemen.

Of course free will being a thing, any immortal can have a change of heart and thus change their alignment. Or be influenced by the power of the quickening such as Darius was and later Duncan was in Season 4 with the Dark Quickening.


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