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thuggernaut


Member Since: Sat May 17, 2008
Posts: 1,390


I would.

I know (Lord how I know) that he hasn't been given much to work with so it's not entirely his fault that his Superman isn't given the acclaim of Gadot's WW or even Batfleck.

But something about him rubs me the wrong way; he just comes off as a very cold fish; very self-interested and calculating. He in it for the bucks and has outright said so. In one sense this is refreshing because it is honest.

On the other hand, it shows that he doesn't care; (I kinda got the same vibe from Welling who wasn't even an actor).

Christopher Reeve *did* have artistic pretensions and a desire to infuse Superman with something special and get to the heart of what make the character long lasting. If you look at some old interviews, he talks about how he thought about the character abstractly and wanted to get underneath to real psychological appeal. (Of course he did enjoy the money too!)

Also, Cavill is TOO SHORT! To me, the Superman costume only looks really impressive and credible in someone say 6'3" to 6'5". It just adds something special to the aesthetic appeal; and getting down to the 6'0" range is noticeable (to me).

Really, the only thing pro-Cavill folks can point to is his bulbous Snyder-y physique; which I personally think is overdone. He just stands there like a pumped-up slab of beef looking all broody or something. (again, that's not his fault; it's how the character has been written).

But alas Cavill is not going anywhere. He knows the Superman flicks he's doing are uninspired trash, but doesn't really care so long as the check clears. I'm not saying that makes him a bad person (it makes him smart!).


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Knight


Member Since: Sat May 17, 2008
Posts: 9,831






    Quote:
    I know that he hasn't been given much to work with so it's not entirely his fault that his Superman isn't given the acclaim of Gadot's WW or even Batfleck.


A shame really. I've seen Henry in other movies and he has talent. Too bad it's wasted just standing around saying one liners and looking like someone close to him just died.


    Quote:
    But something about him rubs me the wrong way; he just comes off as a very cold fish; very self-interested and calculating. He in it for the bucks and has outright said so. In one sense this is refreshing because it is honest.


Honest maybe but he's also given terrible scripts with so little to do. He's been great in other movies, but those had better scripts.


    Quote:
    On the other hand, it shows that he doesn't care; (I kinda got the same vibe from Welling who wasn't even an actor).


Agreed. Henry really doesn't give a crap and neither did Welling.


    Quote:
    Christopher Reeve *did* have artistic pretensions and a desire to infuse Superman with something special and get to the heart of what make the character long lasting. If you look at some old interviews, he talks about how he thought about the character abstractly and wanted to get underneath to real psychological appeal. (Of course he did enjoy the money too!)


That's because Chris was excited to play Superman and it showed in his work. So much so that Chris has become synonymous with the role.


    Quote:
    Also, Cavill is TOO SHORT! To me, the Superman costume only looks really impressive and credible in someone say 6'3" to 6'5". It just adds something special to the aesthetic appeal; and getting down to the 6'0" range is noticeable (to me).


Agreed.

Shame about the costume too. What puzzles me the most about it is the fact that Henry is so ripped and muscular, but he wears a MUSCLE SUIT! Ug...


    Quote:
    Really, the only thing pro-Cavill folks can point to is his bulbous Snyder-y physique; which I personally think is overdone. He just stands there like a pumped-up slab of beef looking all broody or something. (again, that's not his fault; it's how the character has been written).


Wearing. A. Muscle. Suit....

Why buff up only to wear a ridiculous muscle suit?


    Quote:
    But alas Cavill is not going anywhere. He knows the Superman flicks he's doing are uninspired trash, but doesn't really care so long as the check clears. I'm not saying that makes him a bad person (it makes him smart!).


The real irony is he refused the part when he was offered the role in Superman Returns because he felt he wasn't ready. And now that he's playing Necksnapper, all he does is basically one liners and mope around. In terms of money, great choice. In terms of the role itself, it was a terrible choice and wasn't the smartest career move.





It's interesting that a hero/villain performs one amazing feat, or use a power they haven't used for 20+ years, and that automatically propels them to a high status despite scans and evidence to the contrary. I don't know what is worse, selective feat picking that has only been done once or twice 20, or more, years ago or ignoring evidence from scans or the lack thereof. We need to stop putting our favorite heroes/villains on pedestals and start putting them where they really belong. But it's evident that people never will because they would rather accuse others of cherry picking feats, when they don't, and being 'morally superior' when they aren't. I guess being honest and as fair as possible only opens one up to being the target of childish accusations and fault finding by those who insist on acting petty and childish. What happened to a good debate between two civil, mature, adults?
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firstbornson


Location: Krypton
Member Since: Tue Dec 08, 2009
Posts: 895




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Ancient One

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Member Since: Sat May 17, 2008
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liheibao


Member Since: Thu May 07, 2009
Posts: 3,263


[quote


    Quote:
    But something about him rubs me the wrong way; he just comes off as a very cold fish; very self-interested and calculating. He in it for the bucks and has outright said so. In one sense this is refreshing because it is honest.



    Quote:
    On the other hand, it shows that he doesn't care; (I kinda got the same vibe from Welling who wasn't even an actor).



I'm no defender of MOS, but just for some perspective, these are Henry Cavill's words:

"They’re the mythological heroes of our day,” Cavill says, “and I want to help tell their stories for as long I can.” He seems almost territorial over the Man of Steel and his story. “But I have no power over the script,” he admits, “and Chris Terrio [scriptwriter for the series] is a very good writer. There’s so much that can be done with Superman. The Batman story is easy. He’s dark and brooding and dangerous. Superman, I believe, can be a better story, but it requires 10 times the effort to get it right. All I can do is keep my fingers crossed that the big cheeses at the top care as much about the character as I do.”




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Daveym 

Moderator

Location: Lancashire
Member Since: Sat May 17, 2008
Posts: 39,236




    Quote:
    I would.



    Quote:
    I know (Lord how I know) that he hasn't been given much to work with so it's not entirely his fault that his Superman isn't given the acclaim of Gadot's WW or even Batfleck.



    Quote:
    But something about him rubs me the wrong way; he just comes off as a very cold fish; very self-interested and calculating. He in it for the bucks and has outright said so. In one sense this is refreshing because it is honest.


Fair play here - Just about every actor in the movie-world is there for the money. But as you suggest most successful actors bring a good deal of personal charisma to whatever they are working on, no matter how poor the material, something which Henry Cavill hasn't yet been able to project to us.
In spite of the poor material he and we have been served with so far, and the even poorer direction he has had, I still believe Cavill does have the potential to deliver a great Superman. It's just unlikely at this stage that with so much negative baggage and established history weighing down the expectation and presentation he will be able to rise above all of it to really become Superman... it would take a complete rewrite of his character as established, and a director and producer sympathetic to the spirit of Superman, to break through the established inertia and move the character into a light that allows Cavill full reign on reinterpreting both his performance so far and instilling that confidence into his role.

nd in as much as anything that is all Cavill and his Superman needs - confidence and assurance in himself.





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RAB


Member Since: Sat May 17, 2008
Posts: 1,153


As others have pointed out, direction and script play massive factors in whether an actor is good as the character... as I will often point out, Christopher Reeve made an excellent Superman when he had great material in front of him, but there's two (and I'd argue three) examples where he couldn't save the films.

So with that said, I'd be willing to give Cavill another chance. 'Course, I'd want to have a sit-down with him, discuss life and the script to see if indeed he'd work with it. If he did, then he'd have the job. If not, I'd just hire someone else.

As I have a story in mind that would allow me to get rid of the Snyderverse while keeping Cavill and all the people I love from those movies (as I have no problem with the majority of the actors, it's the scripts that suck). But of course, if I wasn't allowed to do that and I just had to start from scratch, that would mean no Henry Cavill involvement.






Ryan Brandt
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omike015 

Mod of Steel

Location: The Bottle City of Kandor
Member Since: Sun Oct 10, 1999
Posts: 4,454



    Quote:
    As others have pointed out, direction and script play massive factors in whether an actor is good as the character... as I will often point out, Christopher Reeve made an excellent Superman when he had great material in front of him, but there's two (and I'd argue three) examples where he couldn't save the films.

I ask you to kill Superman, and you're telling me you couldn't do that one simple thing.




omike015
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RAB


Member Since: Sat May 17, 2008
Posts: 1,153



    Quote:
    I ask you to kill Superman, and you're telling me you couldn't do that one simple thing.


I'm sorry, Mr. Webster!




Ryan Brandt
---
Writer of Ideas
Creator of Stuff

Check out out my Deviantart page!
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thuggernaut


Member Since: Sat May 17, 2008
Posts: 1,390



    Quote:
    , Christopher Reeve made an excellent Superman when he had great material in front of him, but there's two (and I'd argue three) examples where he couldn't save the films.


Disagree strongly.

Reeve was great even in III and IV. He was always just a joy to watch being Clark or Superman.




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JesusFan


Member Since: Sat May 17, 2008
Posts: 20,435


He had the acting talent within him to become and be a decent Superman, but will DC /Warner allow him to become that on film?

Or will they be having him playing second fiddle to their golden Girl WW now on film?

They just need to bring rebirth Superman to the big screen...

And have the Lois Lane and him marriage get added into the film.


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JesusFan


Member Since: Sat May 17, 2008
Posts: 20,435


Right there is the biggest problem, no one knows how to really bring Superman to the movies!


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JesusFan


Member Since: Sat May 17, 2008
Posts: 20,435


Actually, he has stated that he takes playiung Superman very seriously!


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