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jazzbass6


Member Since: Tue Sep 30, 2014
Posts: 667


a return of the 616 to pre-Alonso days AND an absolute retconning of ALL of the last 3 years, especially erasure of Aaron's crap.


P.S. a new actor for Thor who won't bitch about wearing a wig (You know the character that GAVE him his career).


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Knight


Member Since: Sat May 17, 2008
Posts: 9,727





    Quote:

    P.S. a new actor for Thor who won't bitch about wearing a wig (You know the character that GAVE him his career).


If Chris bothered to grow his hair out, there wouldn't be any problems.

My main complaint, though, isn't the hair. It's wearing, I don't know, his HELMET that he WEARS in EVERY issue of Thor but only wore for 2 seconds in the first movie and then a gladiator's helmet that looked like his normal helmet in the third movie. I'll never understand why the director didn't require Chris to wear the helmet in every movie.






It's interesting that a hero/villain performs one amazing feat, or use a power they haven't used for 20+ years, and that automatically propels them to a high status despite scans and evidence to the contrary. I don't know what is worse, selective feat picking that has only been done once or twice 20, or more, years ago or ignoring evidence from scans or the lack thereof. We need to stop putting our favorite heroes/villains on pedestals and start putting them where they really belong. But it's evident that people never will because they would rather accuse others of cherry picking feats, when they don't, and being 'morally superior' when they aren't. I guess being honest and as fair as possible only opens one up to being the target of childish accusations and fault finding by those who insist on acting petty and childish. What happened to a good debate between two civil, mature, adults?
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jazzbass6


Member Since: Tue Sep 30, 2014
Posts: 667


Hemsworth was a diva about the helmet too, but Hiddleston had no issues.

He could have worn it for fight scenes and done without it all the other times. As far as the helmet in Ragnarok, it was cheesy as hell looking.

The hair is something that is b.s., he said in an interview that even his daughter didn't like it either; but guess what Chris..your daughter isn't signing your check.

All the actors of the Lord of the Rings/Hobbit didn't seem to have any problems doing what was required of them for their roles (i.e make up), but Marvel kisses his ass and gives in??? Seriously????

In regard to the directors, they should have stayed with Braunagh throughout and Dark World would have been much improved (especially Malekith) and we wouldn't have had the lame ass sitcom that Ragnarok was.


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Visitor


Member Since: Sun Jul 30, 2017
Posts: 744



    Quote:
    Hemsworth was a diva about the helmet too, but Hiddleston had no issues.



    Quote:
    He could have worn it for fight scenes and done without it all the other times. As far as the helmet in Ragnarok, it was cheesy as hell looking.



    Quote:
    The hair is something that is b.s., he said in an interview that even his daughter didn't like it either; but guess what Chris..your daughter isn't signing your check.



    Quote:
    All the actors of the Lord of the Rings/Hobbit didn't seem to has any problems doing what was required of them for their roles (i.e make up), but Marvel kisses his ass and gives in??? Seriously????



    Quote:
    In regard to the directors, they should have stayed with Braunagh throughout and Dark World would have been much improved (especially Malekith) and we wouldn't have had the lame ass sitcom that Ragnarok was.


Man you sure do complain a lot on here. Tell us what you did like.

Anything at all? Comics or Cinema?




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jazzbass6


Member Since: Tue Sep 30, 2014
Posts: 667


Movies: All of Cap, Thor 1 and 2 (despite the flaws with the Dark Elves and Malekith), Iron Man 1, Dr. Strange, Ant-man, Avengers 1 and 2, GotG 1 and 2

Comics: Everythign Pre-Alonso EIC era b.s.. Like Re-man, I used to spend 200 plus a month on Marvel; now anything Marvel has been erased from my pull list.

Sorry/Not Sorry that I have high standards for what I spend my money on.

As far as my Hemsworth comments, he's become a diva and Feige is giving in to it.


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Upper_Krust


Member Since: Fri Aug 21, 2015
Posts: 234



    Quote:
    a return of the 616 to pre-Alonso days AND an absolute retconning of ALL of the last 3 years, especially erasure of Aaron's crap.


I want the real Thor back and fighting villains (as opposed to his own emotions) but while I'd love it if Aaron explained the whole run as Jane being a villain I don't want the next writer (or subsequent writers) to retcon any of the events that happened under Aaron's run.

Simply put if we 'paper over' history then:

1. Its disrespectful to the Creator - I mean I dislike what he's done as much as almost anybody, BUT Aaron has his fans and the sales have been decent for a Marvel book under Alonso.

2. Its disrespectful to the Fans of Jane-Thor and Aaron's run.

3. Its like 'Aaron haterz' saying "We are afraid of what happened" - end of the day its a story; I didn't like it, but I can move on.


    Quote:
    P.S. a new actor for Thor who won't bitch about wearing a wig (You know the character that GAVE him his career).


I still like Chris (unsurprisingly as I was the very first person in the world to suggest him for Thor)

http://forums.superherohype.com/showthread.php?t=254559&page=3

But I suspect Thor will die during Infinity War and Cap will lift Mjolnir.




You address Omnipotence...tread carefully.
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jazzbass6


Member Since: Tue Sep 30, 2014
Posts: 667


Well, Aaron disrespected his predecessors works with his crap and the fans of said predecessors, so turn about is fair play.

Hemsworth has become a diva (unfortunately: first with the helmet and now the wig) and as I have said elsewhere, the actors of the LotR/Hobbit films and Perlman in Hellboy (for examples) did what had to be done since they were getting PAID to do it.


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Iron Man Unit 007


Member Since: Thu Oct 20, 2011
Posts: 3,267


I want Aaron's run negated and never referenced again.

As to the movies and Hemsworth not wearing the THOR helmet, so what?

Not every costume in every comic book movie is comic book accurate.

Batman movies, the actor has to wear a muscle suit of armor.

Wonder Woman's costume was modified it seems for Gal Gadot's movie.

Black Widow's subsequent Avengers costume seemed to have TRON power lines on it for no reason other then to tweak the costume.

Captain America: the only time his costume was really comic book accurate was in the first movie when he did the USO tours. Then he designs a new suit for Howard Stark which was essentially body armor, his Avengers costume didn't quite appeal to fans from what I recall so for the next cap movie he regains his war uniform from the museum.

Green Lantern: the movie suit was a glow in the dark CGI monstrosity

The first X-men movie, Wolverine makes a wise crack about the costumes and Cyclops asks if he'd rather wear yellow spandex.

The recent Spider-man movies, the costumes are again altered a bit from the comic.

So Hemsworth doesn't want to wear a slightly heavy helmet that may not be comfortable to wear and may easily get knocked off in some of the action scenes? No big deal.

The movies all have a tendency for the hero to unmask at some point to show their full facial expression anyway....and likely to pad the actor's ego a bit.

The only comic book movie that MUST keep the helmet on the character at all times because we must never see his face is JUDGE DREDD. The Stallone movie violated that character rule but the Karl Urban Dredd movie got it right.


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Upper_Krust


Member Since: Fri Aug 21, 2015
Posts: 234



    Quote:
    Well, Aaron disrespected his predecessors works with his crap and the fans of said predecessors, so turn about is fair play.


Aaron may well have disrespected SOME fans with his run, but not ALL fans. Some people love his run and its unfair for you or I to infer we always know best for Thor. One group of fans doesn't have a monopoly to dictate to all the others.

We can voice our opinions online and we can 'vote' with our dollars, but I think individual creators should have some freedom and then we just let the market decide if they have done a good job or not.


    Quote:
    Hemsworth has become a diva (unfortunately: first with the helmet and now the wig) and as I have said elsewhere, the actors of the LotR/Hobbit films and Perlman in Hellboy (for examples) did what had to be done since they were getting PAID to do it.


I don't see what the big deal is about the helmet - note that he actually wears a helmet in his fight with Hulk so its sort of a redundant point.

As for the wig; he's already worn it for FOUR movies so I'd cut the guy some slack. He's been a perfect Thor up to this point.




You address Omnipotence...tread carefully.
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Upper_Krust


Member Since: Fri Aug 21, 2015
Posts: 234



    Quote:
    If Chris bothered to grow his hair out, there wouldn't be any problems.


He stars and acts in other movies you know. Its unfair to ask him to do something that won't fit numerous other roles.


    Quote:
    My main complaint, though, isn't the hair. It's wearing, I don't know, his HELMET that he WEARS in EVERY issue of Thor but only wore for 2 seconds in the first movie and then a gladiator's helmet that looked like his normal helmet in the third movie. I'll never understand why the director didn't require Chris to wear the helmet in every movie.


Its very simple, people want to see his face onscreen, not a helmet.

Same reason why Chris Evans rarely wears the helmet.






You address Omnipotence...tread carefully.
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jazzbass6


Member Since: Tue Sep 30, 2014
Posts: 667



    Quote:

      Quote:
      Well, Aaron disrespected his predecessors works with his crap and the fans of said predecessors, so turn about is fair play.



    Quote:
    Aaron may well have disrespected SOME fans with his run, but not ALL fans. Some people love his run and its unfair for you or I to infer we always know best for Thor. One group of fans doesn't have a monopoly to dictate to all the others.


He sure as hell disrespected his predecessors with his retcon of Mjolnir with the re-donk-ulous Mother Storm b.s., the (to use your own descriptors) emasculation of the "white alpha male" in regard to the character assassination of Thor, the unnecessary maiming, the absolute "punking" of Odin, etc,etc,etc,...


    Quote:
    We can voice our opinions online and we can 'vote' with our dollars, but I think individual creators should have some freedom and then we just let the market decide if they have done a good job or not.



    Quote:

      Quote:
      Hemsworth has become a diva (unfortunately: first with the helmet and now the wig) and as I have said elsewhere, the actors of the LotR/Hobbit films and Perlman in Hellboy (for examples) did what had to be done since they were getting PAID to do it.



    Quote:
    I don't see what the big deal is about the helmet - note that he actually wears a helmet in his fight with Hulk so its sort of a redundant point.


It's irksome, especially since Hiddleston had no issues.


    Quote:
    As for the wig; he's already worn it for FOUR movies so I'd cut the guy some slack. He's been a perfect Thor up to this point.


So wear it for the last two and move on. He knew from go that the character has long hair. I didn't see Orlando Bloom throw a bitch fit because Legolas has long hair, or McCellan, Mortensen, Pace, etc,etc,etc,...




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jazzbass6


Member Since: Tue Sep 30, 2014
Posts: 667



    Quote:
    I want Aaron's run negated and never referenced again.


AGREED!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


    Quote:
    As to the movies and Hemsworth not wearing the THOR helmet, so what?



    Quote:
    Not every costume in every comic book movie is comic book accurate.



    Quote:
    Batman movies, the actor has to wear a muscle suit of armor.



    Quote:
    Wonder Woman's costume was modified it seems for Gal Gadot's movie.



    Quote:
    Black Widow's subsequent Avengers costume seemed to have TRON power lines on it for no reason other then to tweak the costume.



    Quote:
    Captain America: the only time his costume was really comic book accurate was in the first movie when he did the USO tours. Then he designs a new suit for Howard Stark which was essentially body armor, his Avengers costume didn't quite appeal to fans from what I recall so for the next cap movie he regains his war uniform from the museum.



    Quote:
    Green Lantern: the movie suit was a glow in the dark CGI monstrosity



    Quote:
    The first X-men movie, Wolverine makes a wise crack about the costumes and Cyclops asks if he'd rather wear yellow spandex.



    Quote:
    The recent Spider-man movies, the costumes are again altered a bit from the comic.



    Quote:
    So Hemsworth doesn't want to wear a slightly heavy helmet that may not be comfortable to wear and may easily get knocked off in some of the action scenes? No big deal.



    Quote:
    The movies all have a tendency for the hero to unmask at some point to show their full facial expression anyway....and likely to pad the actor's ego a bit.



    Quote:
    The only comic book movie that MUST keep the helmet on the character at all times because we must never see his face is JUDGE DREDD. The Stallone movie violated that character rule but the Karl Urban Dredd movie got it right.


My point of the helmet was the first sign; while irksome considering Hiddleston wore his helmet without qualm. As I said above to UK, Hemsworth came into this know the character has long hair, so deal with it. I use the example of the actors of LotR/Hobbit did what was required of them as far as make-up, so what makes Hemsworth think he's so "special". Do it for the last two movies (Ragnarok and Infinity War), get paid, and move on.




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jazzbass6


Member Since: Tue Sep 30, 2014
Posts: 667



    Quote:

      Quote:
      If Chris bothered to grow his hair out, there wouldn't be any problems.



    Quote:
    He stars and acts in other movies you know. Its unfair to ask him to do something that won't fit numerous other roles.


Hence put on the wig and call it a day. There were no issues with seeing his face with it.


    Quote:

      Quote:
      My main complaint, though, isn't the hair. It's wearing, I don't know, his HELMET that he WEARS in EVERY issue of Thor but only wore for 2 seconds in the first movie and then a gladiator's helmet that looked like his normal helmet in the third movie. I'll never understand why the director didn't require Chris to wear the helmet in every movie.



    Quote:
    Its very simple, people want to see his face onscreen, not a helmet.



    Quote:
    Same reason why Chris Evans rarely wears the helmet.





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Visitor


Member Since: Sun Jul 30, 2017
Posts: 744




    Quote:
    My point of the helmet was the first sign; while irksome considering Hiddleston wore his helmet without qualm. As I said above to UK, Hemsworth came into this know the character has long hair, so deal with it. I use the example of the actors of LotR/Hobbit did what was required of them as far as make-up, so what makes Hemsworth think he's so "special". Do it for the last two movies (Ragnarok and Infinity War), get paid, and move on.


Jazzbass6,

You're displeased. We get that. But it's over, a done deal. Why does this continue to bother you so?

Marvel didn't have a problem honoring his request so why should you?






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Visitor


Member Since: Sun Jul 30, 2017
Posts: 744



    Quote:

      Quote:

        Quote:
        Well, Aaron disrespected his predecessors works with his crap and the fans of said predecessors, so turn about is fair play.

      Quote:

        Quote:
        Aaron may well have disrespected SOME fans with his run, but not ALL fans. Some people love his run and its unfair for you or I to infer we always know best for Thor. One group of fans doesn't have a monopoly to dictate to all the others.



    Quote:
    He sure as hell disrespected his predecessors with his retcon of Mjolnir with the re-donk-ulous Mother Storm b.s., the (to use your own descriptors) emasculation of the "white alpha male" in regard to the character assassination of Thor, the unnecessary maiming, the absolute "punking" of Odin, etc,etc,etc,...


Yeah, it's like we're living in a bad dream. Wasn't there a story put out not long ago, when Mephisto changed Peter Parker's life by not allowing him to ever become married?

I don't remember the details, but I do remember Spiderman fans going ballistic over it and the story was retconned correct?

But Upper_Krust is right to a point. If you don't like it then just don't buy the product. People vote with their dollars. Unfortunately I'm guilty as hell for buying it for this long I'll admit.

I've hung around this long and it pains me to say, if dramatic changes don't happen soon, I'm off this train until things turn around.






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jazzbass6


Member Since: Tue Sep 30, 2014
Posts: 667



    Quote:


      Quote:
      My point of the helmet was the first sign; while irksome considering Hiddleston wore his helmet without qualm. As I said above to UK, Hemsworth came into this know the character has long hair, so deal with it. I use the example of the actors of LotR/Hobbit did what was required of them as far as make-up, so what makes Hemsworth think he's so "special". Do it for the last two movies (Ragnarok and Infinity War), get paid, and move on.



    Quote:
    Jazzbass6,



    Quote:
    You're displeased. We get that. But it's over, a done deal. Why does this continue to bother you so?



    Quote:
    Marvel didn't have a problem honoring his request so why should you?



It sets precedents. Down the road, an actor/ess can come out with "Well, you did this for.... Why not me?"


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Upper_Krust


Member Since: Fri Aug 21, 2015
Posts: 234



    Quote:
    He sure as hell disrespected his predecessors with his retcon of Mjolnir with the re-donk-ulous Mother Storm b.s., the (to use your own descriptors) emasculation of the "white alpha male" in regard to the character assassination of Thor, the unnecessary maiming, the absolute "punking" of Odin, etc,etc,etc,...


I'm not suggesting for one minute I like what he's done, BUT, some people do like it. Enough in fact that its one of Marvel's best selling titles (for what that's worth today...not much). I don't feel comfortable telling other fans they aren't 'true fans' or we need to paper over Aaron's run completely.

I don't mind creators 'stirring things up' and for me, that's never been my problem with Aaron's run - in fact creating controversy is probably Aaron's greatest strength as a creator.

Frankly I DO hope we DON'T get another SJW writer following Aaron. Assuming we don't then fingers crossed the more obvious political positions of Aaron's run will get sidelined or binned...but even still I don't simply want anything retconned.


    Quote:
    It's irksome, especially since Hiddleston had no issues.


Probably because he so rarely had to wear it.


    Quote:
    So wear it for the last two and move on. He knew from go that the character has long hair. I didn't see Orlando Bloom throw a bitch fit because Legolas has long hair, or McCellan, Mortensen, Pace, etc,etc,etc,...


Again its five movies in at this point and he wore the wig for 4 1/2 of those. I don't mind some character development (haircut, losing an eye, etc.). MCU Thor is probably getting killed off in Avengers 3 and if we get a Thor 4 the character might grow the hair back to some extent.




You address Omnipotence...tread carefully.
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jazzbass6


Member Since: Tue Sep 30, 2014
Posts: 667



    Quote:

      Quote:
      He sure as hell disrespected his predecessors with his retcon of Mjolnir with the re-donk-ulous Mother Storm b.s., the (to use your own descriptors) emasculation of the "white alpha male" in regard to the character assassination of Thor, the unnecessary maiming, the absolute "punking" of Odin, etc,etc,etc,...



    Quote:
    I'm not suggesting for one minute I like what he's done, BUT, some people do like it. Enough in fact that its one of Marvel's best selling titles (for what that's worth today...not much). I don't feel comfortable telling other fans they aren't 'true fans' or we need to paper over Aaron's run completely.



    Quote:
    I don't mind creators 'stirring things up' and for me, that's never been my problem with Aaron's run - in fact creating controversy is probably Aaron's greatest strength as a creator.



    Quote:
    Frankly I DO hope we DON'T get another SJW writer following Aaron. Assuming we don't then fingers crossed the more obvious political positions of Aaron's run will get sidelined or binned...but even still I don't simply want anything retconned.


A lot of his nonsense needs to be erased. The Mother Storm which essentially delegitimatized Stormbreaker, Thunderstrike AND Odin; let alone it being "...the Power of Thor", the unnecessary maiming and chopping of his hair, the whole "EMO" drunk attitude/persona character assassination for a start.


    Quote:

      Quote:
      It's irksome, especially since Hiddleston had no issues.



    Quote:
    Probably because he so rarely had to wear it.


As I have said elsewhere, Hemsworth could have worn it as full battle garb.


    Quote:

      Quote:
      So wear it for the last two and move on. He knew from go that the character has long hair. I didn't see Orlando Bloom throw a bitch fit because Legolas has long hair, or McCellan, Mortensen, Pace, etc,etc,etc,...



    Quote:
    Again its five movies in at this point and he wore the wig for 4 1/2 of those. I don't mind some character development (haircut, losing an eye, etc.). MCU Thor is probably getting killed off in Avengers 3 and if we get a Thor 4 the character might grow the hair back to some extent.


I pointed out to Visitor that it could/may set a precedent for future actors/actresses to say they they don't want to do something since they placated Hemsworth. Also, none of that served as character development nor moving the story forward.




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Thurisaz


Member Since: Sat May 17, 2008
Posts: 5,666



    Quote:
    a return of the 616 to pre-Alonso days AND an absolute retconning of ALL of the last 3 years, especially erasure of Aaron's crap.


C'mon. They pull this stuff all the time and it always goes back. That's comics. The status quo always returns after the gimicks and stunts. What we're seeing now may be driven by a diversity theme but it is still the same game. There may not be an official retcon but eventually Thor will be Thor, he'll get his arm back, he'll get mjolnir back, etc., etc.


    Quote:

    P.S. a new actor for Thor who won't bitch about wearing a wig (You know the character that GAVE him his career).


Really superfluous on the big screen. Hemsworth has been an excellent Thor. I don't agree with some of the scripts and directorial decisions but hair, helmet BS doesn't bother me in the least.






[URL=http://s1362.photobucket.com/user/wulabo/media/Doom_zps60271c02.jpg.html][IMG]http://i1362.photobucket.com/albums/r693/wulabo/Doom_zps60271c02.jpg[/IMG][/URL]
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Iron Man Unit 007


Member Since: Thu Oct 20, 2011
Posts: 3,267


There are tales in Hollywood for years of assorted actors/actresses stamping their foot and making demands if not outright usurping control of the project.

Stallone's Judge Dredd being a prime example of usurping control and refusing to wear the helmet all the time as the character is supposed to do.

There are also many tales and legends of how Shatner in both the Trek series and movies would use his..influence...to get certain scenes altered or dialog changed, etc.

One legend that I have never been able to confirm or deny is that in Star Trek 3 Search for Spock, SULU was going to become Captain of the Excelsior and Shatner....shall we say....interfered, thus keeping Sulu on the Enterprise crew and making the problems the two actors had with each other even worse then they already were from the TV series days.

Given that Sulu was the Captain of the Excelsior in Trek 6 and only appeared briefly tends to lend credence to that legend but it is still not confirmed.

Val Kilmer: another actor hard to work with unless he gets his way about whatever is bugging him

Tom Cruise....yeesh.


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Iron Man Unit 007


Member Since: Thu Oct 20, 2011
Posts: 3,267


That Spiderman story is called One More Day and to this day it still stands......


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