Dave Galanter
December 1st 1969 - December 12th 2020
He was loved.

Avengers >> View Post
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Post By
Snowblind

In Reply To
Nathan Summers

Member Since: Fri Dec 26, 2014
Posts: 1,400
Subj: Re: Some questions re: the Gatherers
Posted: Wed Jun 24, 2015 at 01:46:27 pm EDT (Viewed 12 times)
Reply Subj: Some questions re: the Gatherers
Posted: Wed Jun 24, 2015 at 08:10:06 am EDT (Viewed 340 times)

Previous Post

Spoke with Steve Epting some years ago and he advised that Proctor wasn't initially going to be an alternate Dane Whitman, hence why he gave him black hair (instead of Dane's brown). So any theories who else he might initially have been planned as?

Also guesses for who the other Gatherer members were counterparts of?
•    Magdalene – Marissa Darrow
•    Swordsman/ Phillip Jarvert - ?
•    Coal Tiger – Black Panther
•    Cassandra – fans suggest Madame Web but I'm not convinced
•    Sloth - ?
•    Anti-Vision – Vision but was A-V based on Simon Williams' engrams?
•    Tabula – I'd suggest Arnim Zola's android Primus
•    Rik – Rick Jones
•    Sliver - ?
•    Tarkas - ?
•    Korg - ?
•    Jocasta – pretty obvious but whose engrams was the alternate based on?

Also, one of the most interesting but later ignored aspects of the Gatherers Saga was the idea that two alternative versions of the same character couldn't exist for long in the same reality. We'd had that hinted at before, as far back as Mr Fantastic and the Brute, but this storyline looked for a while like it might use that front and centre; again it was forgotten in the chaos that came after.

I was also disappointed that we never found out why dark Dane might take the name - or title – of Proctor. A proctor is an official appointed to maintain good order, especially in an academic situation, so more generally conferred upon a scholar than a warrior.


The earlier parts of the Gatherer arc make it seem it's going to tie into the Celestial Madonna story. When Javert is shown a hologram of Moondragon he calls her Mantis, and his partner is (probably) named after Mary Magdalene. Maybe some of the other Gatherers would be connected to that same period in Avengers history?

> • Swordsman/ Phillip Jarvert - ?

I never understood the deal with the Swordsman. Dane makes a big deal about Javert having the exact same fighting style as Duquesne so they're definitely counterparts, but later on they're treated like two separate people. And why two different names?

I always wondered about Exodus, too. When the Avengers first meet him, Dane says something about him seems familiar. That's explained in the post-Ultraverse Black Knight one-shot as Dane's hazy memory of the 12th century. I always thought Exodus and Proctor looked a lot alike, which was probably just cuz Epting designed both of them (Thane Ector has kind of a similar look too I guess), but maybe there was originally going to be a connection? I doubt Exodus was originally supposed to be Eobar Garrington's 800 year old former bff, and he's another biblical name to boot.

Did Epting say anything else interesting about that Avengers team? I talked to Bob Harras at a con a long time ago and always wished I asked him more about it. Only things I remember from the conversation was that nobody told him about Bloodwraith until that Avengers Annual was already done and that the Black Knight wouldn't be in any Avengers cartoon because the people making the cartoons didn't care about the Black Knight.


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