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Post By
Marv

Member Since: Sat Jan 24, 2015
Posts: 5,697
In Reply To
abhijit

Subj: Re: and yet
Posted: Thu Feb 02, 2017 at 04:19:32 am EST (Viewed 502 times)
Reply Subj: Re: That's quite a stretch...
Posted: Thu Feb 02, 2017 at 01:43:47 am EST (Viewed 493 times)

Previous Post


    Quote:
    ...to say that three favorable appearances suggests that Superman will "always" be showed as superior against Thor, especially since both Jurgens and Buseik are Superman advocates and were given carte blanche to publish their views as such. If a pro-Thor writer were given similar liberties, I wonder if you would argue to the veracity of the published stories as many others are doing now. Sadly, you are probably right, but not for the reasons you think. As DC's flagship character (IMO more so than Batman), I doubt that we will ever see Superman lose another battle to any Marvel character, even one whose power set exploits one of Superman's known weaknesses.


Three favorable appearances between three different writers? Yes, that's too much of a proof in Superman's favor.

And not exactly in comparison to Superman only. Thor struggled against Kalibak and needed J'onn to help him to defeat him.

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In fact Kalibak shrugged off a sucker attack from Mjolnir to the back of the head and manhandled Thor just a page later.

Superman though?

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Not even a contest.

in the other crossover, at first Thor fought Superman, Wonder Woman and Martian Manhunter and held his own. he floors superman with an hammer toss, then takes a double punch from Supes and Manhunter, then floors manhunter and both him and supes are not seen again until the end, and then he fights Wonder woman.

http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-LcnC9Go4bjY/VTDx0kZuS5I/AAAAAAAKkOw/at0zNLOEcOI/s1600/p5_43%2Bcopy.jpg
http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-dgOo4bQB4us/VTDx2LtKzeI/AAAAAAAKkPA/prYjRw1IEPM/s1600/p5_44%2Bcopy.jpg
http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-FQ6HcJTPSo0/VTDx2Q8M8jI/AAAAAAAKkPE/ywuGC5NtU68/s1600/p5_45%2Bcopy.jpg
http://3.bp.blogspot.com/-PoeLnASXmfg/VTDyYowlijI/AAAAAAAKkVM/kOL8_MAjRtw/s1600/p6_5.jpg
http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-AvOUhxa96ho/VTDyXhDknmI/AAAAAAAKkU8/0hbahgn-KsI/s1600/p6_6%2Bcopy.jpg
http://3.bp.blogspot.com/-R60yZebiICE/VTDyZpT2TuI/AAAAAAAKkVU/d2CfY4FoRno/s1600/p6_8%2Bcopy.jpg

the fight was interrupted by Wanda chaos magic with no one truly koed, but Thor fought equally with arguably the 3 strongest fighters on the other team.

in the second fight Supes "barely" managed a takedown of Thor, which seems to give him an edge in strenght apparently. But in this fight Thor had underestimanted the kryptonian, walked into his heat vision and got distracted by his stopping mjolnir.

https://jeremiahkleckner.files.wordpress.com/2015/05/superman-vs-thor001-copy-e1432566310114.jpg?w=642&h=300

but later on, he has "taken the measure" of the kryptonian, so the fight might go differently because supes had "barely" won before

https://qph.ec.quoracdn.net/main-qimg-07fcc06eb7589be07f06fa8c875d5186
https://qph.ec.quoracdn.net/main-qimg-706ab81478a7cf33454acc611fc04aed

we don't have a rematch, but we do have Supes feeling "the power of thor" when the thundergod gives him the hammer thanks to the failsafe of it being a "special occasion", and he feels the power of Thor as being something he "never felt" despite his being pretty powerful himself.

https://qph.ec.quoracdn.net/main-qimg-8226ce46dce2adf18452e6a2c925a207
https://qph.ec.quoracdn.net/main-qimg-99c0116cc699c7de3e568b908d09d085-c
https://qph.ec.quoracdn.net/main-qimg-ddbcbc4e3988a117c542bb8d556965f0

considering that in the Access fight Superman doesn't do anything more than zapping all of them, and he is made somehow of elettricity, i don't see how this gives him any kind of advantage over Thor. He managed to free everyone from mind control, but if he had had to fight everyone at the same time i don't see how he could have succeded.

As for KAlibak being as strong as the Hulk in the narration, it's a trope for enemies to be called out as being as strong as a rival of the hero. Thor called Agger Minotaur form "as strong as the Hulk" before defeating him and Ulik combined in one hit, and Ulik called himself as strong as a Thor before being manhandled by the Maestro; Superman called BOTH Hulk and Thor "the strongest he ever faced". I think that those comments are usually meant ot say the threat is in the same class as the hero mentioned, but on an average, not at peak. Thor needing help from Manhunter doesn't mean he couldn't have beaten Kalibak on his own, just like it didnt mean that Superman couldn't have when manhunter helped him against thor himself.

I Can give a very righteous Supes a slight edge in strenght as i would give a very pissed off Hulk over Thor, but only if the thundergod is not giving his all, and i think the strenght differential is not that large even in such an occasion, they are still in the same range of power, and thor could match them if he used his magical forms of amping be they berseker rage or magic belt. And in pure power, very few can match the god of Thunder, who has feats on cosmic scales and toppled skyfathers and cosmic entities in his best feats. So i think overall Supes edges Thor in phisical aspects, but thor edges Supes in power on an average, and peak versions of both could probably one shot an average portrayal of the other. Superman has a lot more weaknesses that can be exploited though, be them Red Sun, Kryptonite, Magic, all things mjolnir could find a way to use if Thor required it to. Save Superman getting the Worldserpent Venom or a Fang of his on his hand i don't see him having the same degree of use of a trump card, it's less likely.


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