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Post By
HammerTime

Member Since: Sun Jan 07, 2018
Posts: 545
In Reply To
zvelf

Member Since: Sat May 17, 2008
Posts: 9,324
Subj: Re: Thanos vs. Darkseid (one last time!)
Posted: Wed Jan 31, 2018 at 06:57:45 pm EST (Viewed 40 times)
Reply Subj: Re: Thanos vs. Darkseid (one last time!)
Posted: Wed Jan 31, 2018 at 08:10:11 am EST (Viewed 51 times)



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    Squirrel Girl is above top tier. She beats everyone. The title of her comic is the UNBEATABLE Squirrel Girl. But really, you've got to be pretty desperate to resort to a comedy showing that is intentionally not to be taken seriously.


Do you say she's above top tier in jest or were you making a serious argument? Her respect thread is here:

https://www.reddit.com/r/respectthreads/comments/61ikf2/respect_the_unbeatable_squirrel_girl_marvel_616/

She's strong but far from top tier.

And I was clear with you, is the story canon (canon = reality) and you said it's up to the reader. So you can ring the bells of desperation all you want, but it won't overcome that the story has an argument for reality by your own admission.


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      But I thought it was Drax’s skyfather punch, not Thanos weakened state, that caused the chest hole punch.



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    They are not mutually exclusive.



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      The only reason for a retcon would be an admission that there was nothing special about Drax’s punch, that Thanos was indeed weakened. So when weakened, his molecular structure loses density and is susceptible to body hole punches. Interesting...



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    I think Starlin is so protective of Thanos and sees him as so far above Drax that even with Drax's special advantage against Thanos, Starlin thought that was an inappropriate depiction. But your missing the point, Starlin created an in-canon excuse that this would not have happened to a normal Thanos.



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      And whether he was distracted or not now has an impact on his durability against body hole punches?



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    Being distracted has an impact on his ability to play defense certainly.


Exactly. To play defense, not to warp physiology and molecular structure from hard as steel to soft as tissue paper. We're beating a dead horse - I concede any further point as I can't be clearer on my view and we've both established our reasons for disagreeing.


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      No, it’s just that he waded through a Blackbolt blast that didnt destroy half the planet, end reality, nothing as intense as the magnitude readers have been led to believe BB is capable of. Very minor surrounding damage, a huge letdown. Had BB’s scream destroyed the planet in the process, okay, I’m with you. but nothing like that happened.



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    This is nitpicking in the extreme. This type of thing happens all the time in comics in which immense collateral damage would upend the plot and so is ignored, especially when cosmic being fight.


Fine. Play it your way. How strong then do you believe Black Bolt's yell is and how strong was it when he used it against Thanos? Please be as precise as possible.


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        Wow, way to distort the context. When Surfer first met Loki, Surfer didn't know who he was. Surfer was in a hopeless and anguished state being trapped on Earth and didn't care about living in that moment. That is totally not what Surfer is normally like for the vast majority of his existence. There have been many instances in which Surfer goes into battle fervently. His battle with and loss to Thanos is one of those instances. But I see. For you anytime Thanos looks good, it doesn't count because whoever he looks good against is jobbing or not putting his full effort into it. Got it.
      Im not arguing that it doesn’t count, just that considerations have to be made. Surfer to me is like a captain Picard with fighting skills. Even if he appears fervent, it’s still captain Picard. Norrin radd by nature is a pacifist, not a warrior. I’m not convinced that he engages in battle with the same determination or intensity, which might even impact his durability.



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    But your reasoning is flawed. Just because Surfer sometimes holds back doesn't mean he's always holding back, and there's no indication that he was holding back against Thanos.


I didn't say he's always holding back, just that it's often enough to leave a shadow of doubt I can't ignore. Whether he doesn't focus enough, isn't evil enough to do what he's capable of, I don't know. But that's my opinion.


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        I see. So anytime Thanos looks good, it doesn't count because whoever he looks good against is a jobber. Got it. Terrax has beaten virtually all the other heralds outside of Morg and Surfer. Terrax has destroyed a whole planet with one swing of his axe. Terrax is no weakling.
      Terrax to me is low top tier, like Steppenwolf or Wonder Woman. Strong, but no match for a real top tier. Have you seen the recent JLA movie? Steppenwolf was beating up on Wonder Woman and Aquaman but was nothing but a rag doll to Superman. Steppenwolf once drove his axe on Superman’s shoulder and Superman was completely unfazed. “Hello, invulnerable?” Is what Superman said, in fact.


Okay, well this is why I don't consider him a true top tier. Absolute no-sell.

https://orig00.deviantart.net/fe8a/f/2011/363/8/b/sentry_vs_terrax_by_chicho234-d4kn968.jpg

https://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/6/67330/1932699-sentry_terrax_2.jpg

Not to open up another debate, but Sentry and Superman, the similarities and comparability, you get where this would go if we continued and I really don't care to do that.


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    Except I gave you reasons for considering Terrax as very powerful and you gave me none and went into a non sequitur on the Justice League movie.


Fair enough. See above on why I feel as I do.


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        I see. So anytime Thanos looks good, it doesn't count because whoever he looks good against is a jobber. Got it. See, anyone could argue like you, i.e., completely rationalize and then dismiss every example brought up, but what you're doing is no longer using reason to choose, you're just choosing your reasons.
      BRB has been beaten by Surfer just as bad. “You are no match for me” said a very mellow and pacifist Surfer trying to talk out of a fight.



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    So you will only accept Thanos' prowess if he defeats a top tier, by which you mean about 5 characters but Surfer doesn't count. Gotcha.


I'm willing to revisit this - I just found his original fight with abomination and despite his pacifism he still fought hard and won.


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        I was being generous. But I'll save you from looking into it and show you exactly what the comic says: "His inquiries have led him to one being of infinite power. They call her the Maker - but once she was known as the Beyonder." But I know, I know, it doesn't count because the Maker was jobbing.
      I still insist onlooking into this. I certain there is missing context.



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    Well, I didn't expect you to accept it just like you didn't accept anything else despite it being right there in the comic.


Because I like to check for context and not blindly accept your word for it. Someone could be uber powerful and not know how to apply it. Nebula with the IG was getting REAMED at first by the cosmic beings before something clicked and she demolished them. You have to take into account experience, mental stability, and awareness of one even has those omnipotent powers. That's why you shouldn't expect me to immediately accept your arguments, you must have a high opinion of yourself.




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