Community >> View Post
·
Post By
Reverend Meteor

In Reply To
seeker

Subj: Re: Atheists unite!!!!
Posted: Tue Jan 08, 2008 at 01:37:01 pm EST (Viewed 4 times)
Reply Subj: Re: Atheists unite!!!!
Posted: Mon Jan 07, 2008 at 03:57:07 pm EST (Viewed 2 times)

Previous Post

> > This is just something I’ve been wondering different people’s opinions on for awhile. It is not intended to offend anyone or their religious beliefs nor is this being used for anything besides my own personal curiosity.
> >
> > One justification for human dominion of the planet is that humans are a superior species or of a higher order of species than others.
>
> We have fire and opposable digits...we are superior. The problem is we're also very stupid \:\)
>
Ironically true. We are at the same time the smartest and dumbest species on the planet.



> > With all of that in mind and assuming for a moment that gods are of a higher order above humans AND that G-d or gods are real what are your opinions/answers to the following questions:
> >
> > Remember, for the sake of discussion assume that the being in the question is real, is a higher order of being, and what the claim is.
> >
> > 1.    Inspired by Neil Gaiman’s The Sandman, is the greatest thing a human can achieve in life to die at the hands of G-d since doing so would serve a higher power and at the same time dispel any questions about the existence of such beings? What if it was dying at the hands of a polytheistic god such as Apollo?
>
> I'm not a fan of dying to serve someone else's agenda
>
> Besides Apollo was a pederast...
>
I just cited Apollo as an example. I wasn't trying to get to specific.


> Pretending for the moment that he's real....I guess he has the right to do what he wants.
>
> My problem is not what he does but what he expects out of us. He can't expect us to be perfect if the world isn't perfect
>
I wonder about that often as well.

>
> This is why I can't buy into the concept of "God". I can't accept that this aloof omnipotent being chooses to do nothing to help good people yet demands their obedience.
>
I've thought about it at times and it is one of those problems. If you do too much people would depend on G-d too much. Not enough and the world goes down the toilet. One view is that G-d does enough to let the world gets by, but due to free will allows humans quite a bit of freedom. Of course, if you are suffering this doesn't comfort you much.
How much does G-d help before he becomes a dictator? Rebellion anyone?

>
> > 4.    What about a lesser god such as Ares, ancient Greek god of savage warfare or Tyr, Norse god of honorable warfare? Does he have the right to strike down a mortal who has offended him? What about an entire community? Would it depend on the god? (Ex. A more benevolent on such as Baldur or Athena)
>
> Sure. I stomp on ants and roaches.
>
That's one perspective. If the ant or roach could think they might take issue with that, but since from one view gods are so far above us we would b like that to them.

> > 5.    If G-d wanted you to die and told you it is for the good of Earth, but would not explain why would you do it?
>
> um...what makes you think I WOULD do it if given the choice?
>
Inate human goodness? :-/

> > 6.    What if polytheistic god wanted you to die without explaining why and claimed it was for the good of Earth? Would you go ahead and die? What if they explained it to you? Would it depend on the god? (Ex. A more benevolent on such as Baldur or Athena)
>
> If given the choice I would let earth suffer along with me \:\)
>
If your dead you may not be suffering. \:\-D

> > 7.    Should G-d be held to the same standards as humans? Or due to being beyond human are He/they beyond human concepts of good and evil or at least human judgment and morality?
>
> I guess it depends. If "God" holds us to those same standards and expects us to be good not evil then he really shouldn't hold himself in a position to be evil. If God can be evil then why should we worship him?
>
> > 8.    The same above except this time for gods instead of G-d.
>
> Yes. Since they aren't everything, just aspects of this thing or that thing I guess they aren't perfect just like humans.
>
But if they are aspects would not they perhaps be so fundamentally different from humans that the same morality may not be applicable to them?

> > > This is just something I’ve been wondering different people’s opinions on for awhile. It is not intended to offend anyone or their religious beliefs nor is this being used for anything besides my own personal curiosity.
> > >
> > > One justification for human dominion of the planet is that humans are a superior species or of a higher order of species than others.
> >
> > We have fire and opposable digits...we are superior. The problem is we're also very stupid \:\)
> >
> Ironically true. We are at the same time the smartest and dumbest species on the planet.
>
>
>
> > > With all of that in mind and assuming for a moment that gods are of a higher order above humans AND that G-d or gods are real what are your opinions/answers to the following questions:
> > >
> > > Remember, for the sake of discussion assume that the being in the question is real, is a higher order of being, and what the claim is.
> > >
> > > 1.    Inspired by Neil Gaiman’s The Sandman, is the greatest thing a human can achieve in life to die at the hands of G-d since doing so would serve a higher power and at the same time dispel any questions about the existence of such beings? What if it was dying at the hands of a polytheistic god such as Apollo?
> >
> > I'm not a fan of dying to serve someone else's agenda
> >
> > Besides Apollo was a pederast...
> >
> I just cited Apollo as an example. I wasn't trying to get to specific.
>
>
> > Pretending for the moment that he's real....I guess he has the right to do what he wants.
> >
> > My problem is not what he does but what he expects out of us. He can't expect us to be perfect if the world isn't perfect
> >
> I wonder about that often as well.
>
> >
> > This is why I can't buy into the concept of "God". I can't accept that this aloof omnipotent being chooses to do nothing to help good people yet demands their obedience.
> >
> I've thought about it at times and it is one of those problems. If you do too much people would depend on G-d too much. Not enough and the world goes down the toilet. One view is that G-d does enough to let the world gets by, but due to free will allows humans quite a bit of freedom. Of course, if you are suffering this doesn't comfort you much.
> How much does G-d help before he becomes a dictator? Rebellion anyone?

A part of me has always wondered if God was real maybe he just created the universe and left it alone after the work was done. He gave us free will. What we choose to do with it is on us. Maybe holding him responsible for the problems in our lives is a little unfair.

> > > 4.    What about a lesser god such as Ares, ancient Greek god of savage warfare or Tyr, Norse god of honorable warfare? Does he have the right to strike down a mortal who has offended him? What about an entire community? Would it depend on the god? (Ex. A more benevolent on such as Baldur or Athena)
> >
> > Sure. I stomp on ants and roaches.
> >
> That's one perspective. If the ant or roach could think they might take issue with that, but since from one view gods are so far above us we would b like that to them.

True.

> > > 5.    If G-d wanted you to die and told you it is for the good of Earth, but would not explain why would you do it?
> >
> > um...what makes you think I WOULD do it if given the choice?
> >
> Inate human goodness? :-/

I truly wish I possessed that.

> > > 6.    What if polytheistic god wanted you to die without explaining why and claimed it was for the good of Earth? Would you go ahead and die? What if they explained it to you? Would it depend on the god? (Ex. A more benevolent on such as Baldur or Athena)
> >
> > If given the choice I would let earth suffer along with me \:\)
> >
> If your dead you may not be suffering. \:\-D

That's how I view death. When you die you die. You're just a cold corpse. So to do anything to hasten my death seems completely illogical to me. If I ever have children then I could understand a heroic sacrifice.

> > > 7.    Should G-d be held to the same standards as humans? Or due to being beyond human are He/they beyond human concepts of good and evil or at least human judgment and morality?
> >
> > I guess it depends. If "God" holds us to those same standards and expects us to be good not evil then he really shouldn't hold himself in a position to be evil. If God can be evil then why should we worship him?
> >
> > > 8.    The same above except this time for gods instead of G-d.
> >
> > Yes. Since they aren't everything, just aspects of this thing or that thing I guess they aren't perfect just like humans.
> >
> But if they are aspects would not they perhaps be so fundamentally different from humans that the same morality may not be applicable to them?

Maybe that makes me a hypocrite. I am hypocritical on a wide array of subjects. I agree that they may be beyond good or evil but we do not look at say Apollo as being perfect. But organized religion tends to bestow that honor to God/Allah/Yahweh. I would never bow before a non-perfect being.




Posted with Microsoft Internet Explorer 7 on Windows XP
Alvaro's Comicboards powered by On Topic™ © 2003-2022 Powermad Software
All the content of these boards Copyright © 1996-2022 by Comicboards/TVShowboards. Software Copyright © 2003-2022 Powermad Software