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Post By
bd2999 
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Member Since: Sat May 17, 2008
In Reply To
Ancient One 
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Member Since: Sat May 17, 2008
Posts: 7,925
Subj: Re: Religion - your beliefs?
Posted: Fri May 04, 2018 at 04:00:57 pm CDT (Viewed 883 times)
Reply Subj: Re: Religion - your beliefs?
Posted: Fri May 04, 2018 at 02:40:28 pm CDT (Viewed 866 times)



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      Yes, but even with that there is finding it and then understanding it. There are loads of things that we think we have a grasp on that really are unknown entirely or nearly so.

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        What are the smallest unit of things, what actually is matter at the core level? We do not have perfect grasps on even things that are understood.



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    Right again. For example, we know what light is, but nobody understands why it behaves the way it does.


Indeed, among other things.


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      I am not saying it will never be known or anything. Or that nothing can be done because we do not have this information. It just seems that there might be limitations that may or may not be overcome.



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    I'm more optimistic. I could cite people - scientists - saying exactly the same thing going right back to and including Newton.


I am not that optimistic depending on the question, but it usually does not matter too much. At least not so far. We do not understand all of quantum mechanics but quantum tunneling is used effectively in numerous electronic chips.


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    The cutting edge boundaries of science today, the unknowns, are the commonplace of tomorrow.


Sure, but even assuming various optimistic projections one would have to accept various pessimistic realities as well on top of those. Science does not work in a bubble. What impact will various funding factors or global realities have on these things?

What about research priorities in the first place? The push of anti-intellectual thought from many funding groups is the death kneel for many critical areas that are resource intense.

I am being overall pessimistic, but just as somebody in the medical/biological sciences. There are the technical difficulties and then there are the issues outside of that and there is major overlap.


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        We'll get there.

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        Maybe, with some issues I think humanity will. With others it is harder to say. Because of the level and because humanity will likely not be around forever.

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          I mean some of the issues are pretty massive. I recall hearing the amount of work it took to sense a gravity wave. Impressive, but it is hard to figure out that sort of stuff, not impossible but just very hard and you need to be lucky.

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            Just merging general relativity with quantum mechanics would be one of the biggest accomplishments ever.



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    Indeed. But we have our best people working on it!


Maybe, I could get on my soap box but many good scientists or potentially good ones are turning away from it. Given how hard funding is to get in the first place.

This varies by the problem, but in physics it can be fairly challenging to get funding for things that are perceived as abstract.



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    Far more than just the discovery of the Higgs has come out of the LHC. It may take decades to fully understand all the information they've gathered AND they're planning a new, more powerful collider which will unlock even more.


I am not dismissing any of the work out of that at all. There is quite a bit to learn from it. A fair bit, but there are also limitations. I am not proposing a god of the gaps or anything.

Just saying, I am skeptical that we will approach knowing what we would like to know about things.


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    We don't know where the breakthrough will come. It may be through one of the colliders, it may be through observations made on extremely distant objects, it may be through mathematics, or some combination of any of a dozen scientific disciplines.


Maybe, maybe not. It depends on many things. There are cool things everyday, but it is also possible that we will just wipe ourselves out in the meanwhile.

Or, if the universe is expanding at accelerating rates, seems to be, that what we are able to observe is always shrinking anyway. So, we may be missing out on quite a bit.

I sound overally pessimistic here and admit as much. Just given the direction of funding for science and folks having harder times getting the research going it is getting harder and harder to do some of the things.

Does not mean learning will stop but I fear for the future of science and those that do it. Sometimes more than others.

And, like I said, a fair bit of luck is needed to explore some things we would love to know. That, loads of money and many clever people looking at it. Does not mean it is not possible, just challenging.

The amount of things we have learned has grown at a rapid rate, considering science as a method for learning is fairly young. At least the formal version.


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    But I remain confident it will come.


It really depends on the question. I am pretty confident we will never know everything. I think we will continue learning more about various things. Maybe even some of the pretty big ones.





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