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Member Since: Sat May 17, 2008
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Member Since: Sat May 17, 2008
Posts: 5,233
Subj: Re: I would be careful with that Bible reading...
Posted: Sat Jan 19, 2019 at 08:06:38 am EST (Viewed 576 times)
Reply Subj: Re: I would be careful with that Bible reading...
Posted: Fri Jan 18, 2019 at 05:45:32 pm EST (Viewed 614 times)

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    Except that is not what I said in that response. I think that view is bigoted. If he is as a person or not I cannot say but that view is. And that a mock religious justification was given.

So to be clear, a person can have bigoted views but not be a bigot? Correct?

    I am not sure you can force anybody to make anything for something else. The guy took his recourse and stopped making things for everybody. He deeply believed what he was doing but his religious grounding was flawed. Just like the one Kentucky clerk who decided that her religious belief was more important than the law was.

Your dancing around my question. Clearly, you can force businesses to serve and make things for people through state and federal anti-discrimination laws. So since you're so stubborn, let me narrow my question for you. Do you believe state and federal anti-discrimination laws should prevent wedding cake bakers from having a business if they refuse to serve homosexuals?

I want to cycle back before I go into your things, because I addressed some points of yours at the start that you did not really address much at all. You are quite good at changing a topic altogether into somewhat related but not the topic at hand.

Your initial points to Silver Surfer were that Christians have very solid reasoning for their beliefs. You go as far as to say that their religious text pretty much orders them to be that way. However, not all Christians are. I provided something questioning the verse you choose. You shifted the goalposts from their views being based on sound reasoning to what they believe.

So, your argument boils down to them being able to believe whatever they want to believe with whatever loose context they choose to believe it.

You also made a bunch of other claims about people that do not believe like you are weak minded idiots. A random judgement. Particularly considering the exact Bible quote you brought up was not translated that way until about 1946. Hardly 2000 years, like you were claiming.

There are over 2000 Bible versus on poverty and the poor. Only a handful on homosexuality. So any Christian defining the faith by that as a moral feature while ignoring the other teachers is acting shady.

Jesus himself never condemned it. The Old Testiment did. Hell, even arguing for the belief in traditional marriage from the Bible is bunk. If we take it at its word there is support for polygamy, marrying your rapist and so on. How often are those held up today as virtues?

So, you can change a subject wildly. Good for you.

As to your questions, which I will answer and not change the subject on you.

1. A person could. Just like any given person could have a racist, bigoted or sexist view and not be totally in that area. One could argue they are spectrums anyway and where you put the line with vary.

The moral of the story is there is not as much Biblical proof as you like to think there is or many Christians like to think there is. It is knocked in places, but there is more about acceptance and helping the poor and turning away from greed and so on than that.

Yet, you seem to prefer to support the point of view that allows one person to degrade another person. A person has the legal right to say what they want in the US but that does not mean they have a super sound argument for it. They can just pull text out and do it. And are able to rationalize it. That does not make it less wrong.

2. That is not true, really. A person could have stopped running their business and been done with it. You also answered the question. The only question for you is do you think a person's religious rights overrides somebody else's rights. I imagine that you do, given that you seem to find it pretty compelling in your response to SS.

I question at the core the reason why religious conservatives feel that way. The Bible has been used for numerous ends as a defense. This one is no different. People have had deeply held beliefs about horrible things and have corrupted the Bible to support it.

This is much less horrible than those but the current iteration, but I would love for somebody to remind these folks of the Bible's numerous other stances. Ones that I am sure you would be opposed to, but seem to support people using when they back your views.

The Bible is a contradictory book, but the teachings of Jesus are mostly pretty clear.

Look Raist bunnies...
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