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Post By
The Rev

In Reply To
Talezite

Subj: Re: Curiosities to ponder (semi long response) pt 2
Posted: Sat Jan 05, 2008 at 01:10:21 pm EST
Reply Subj: Re: Curiosities to ponder (semi long response) pt 2
Posted: Fri Jan 04, 2008 at 07:00:25 pm EST

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> > b)Hourman......The andriod hourman was a cool character to me in that he has a sense of responsibilty and tried to learn to be human who also controlling time powers of great magnitude. The reason I thought this was good was that in his fights with Amazo and interactions with Snapper Carr you got to see a very heroic character who was trapped in time and was a keeper of the Rex Tyler legacy. Things that stuck with me ...Snapper car's role and his friendship with Hourman. Hourman stuggling with the identity of himself and temporal variants. Personally I was a little let down when this series ended because I thought the premise was so strong. Ultimately his sacrifice in JSA to bring back Rex was moving. I think altruistic characters are a rare and good thing in comics. Another thing that stuck me is that the art fit this comic perfectly. Rags Morales style really set the tone with the series.
> >
> I have to agree. I came onto this series very late thinking that this Hourman could never carry his own book but when a friend told me what I was missing I tried it and was hooked. I miss Bethany and all of their interactions but I do believe that the thing I miss most is this representation of Snapper.
>
> > c) Damage....The whole idea of character who does not know who his parents are is always nice to see play out. The references to the human bomb, Phantom lady and Iron Munroe were nice touches. Next to Star man Damage is the best thing to spin out of Zero Hour. (imo) Things that stuck with me was how Damage's raw power level was a reached strange level. The whole restarting of the DCU from an explosion of his is a crazy idea.
> >
> I'm just glad I'm not the only one who enjoyed this book. This guy is still one of my favortie characters and I am elated to see him on the team.
>
> > d)Hawkman.....The fist three years of the Hawkman series (or so) was a great read. The whole perpetual rencarnate thing was cool. In a way we could say Carter Hall is like a Highlander with a wing pack. Things that stuck out to me was the development of St Roch (the city) and the acknowledgement that Carter and Ray Palmer (silver age Atom) have always been good friends even through they are differant characters. Unlike the combative relationship he has with Green Arrow, Ray and Carter could sit down and talk about archeology and lost civilizations and thats great stuff! The relationship to Kendra is always interesting and it has the ups and downs that many relationships always have but on a magnified level if you tie in thier tied reincarnation backstory. I never read this title was it was just Hawkgirl. Use of the Shadow Thief as a bad guy as well as the Gentleman ghost is always cool to see as they are unique Hawkman villians.
> >
> The only comment I would make to this is one that I have made repeatedly on this board...Simonson is best read in chunks. If you can find it for little expense, go back and pick up the Hawkgirl and sit down and read it all at once. I found it to be pretty enjoyable that way rather than trying to read it a book at a time. You are right though that Johns' run on the book was excellent.
>
> > e) The Doctor Mignight series: This was a nice read that made Midnight cool to me again, The painted art set a nice tone and as always Wagner can deliver a character driven story. To me this paved the way to the current Doctor Midnight (in the JSA) and remined me that he was not just another batman clone. This is worth digging for if you have not read it and has an interesting history of delay....that stuck with me. That of course was back in the day when series that were too late just got released in thier entirely later on rater than making the reader wait months between issues. Ah the good ole days ;\)
> >
> I had almost forgotten about this series. These were some other books that I found in a bargain bin for $1 each or I might have never bought them. A great story and a classic twist on a very similar origin to the classic character.
>
> > Wildcat (limted series Wildcat vs Batman), Spectre, and Ray series I will post soon........I am outta time unfortunately.
> >
> I look forward to what you have to say. I really enjoyed the Ray much more than I ever thought I would and Ostrander's Spectre is second only to Starman in my favorites list. It's funny how I find myself more drawn to some of these anciliary books than I do the core book. I will always love All Star, All Star Squadron, Infinity, Inc., JSA, and now Justice Society but some of these individual character books are great.
>
> The Rev


Hey all. Cool Rev, I enjoy reading your posts as well. Always good to shoot the breeze with fellow fans and all that. I think the reason that the "secondary" series are so good (ie: the Spectre) etc is that there is alot of room for interperation on the character in that his history is so spread out over the years and particually with the Spectre the concept and perception of vengeance seems to change. (The JM Dematies series where Hal Jordan had the mantle of the Wrath of God comes to mind)

onto part2

Wildcat series (limited Wildcat vs Batman): To me this was a cool series in that it had a classic fight I am sure fans were curious to see. The whole Teacher(Wildcat) vs Student (Bruce Wayne/Batman) dynamic. It was not the most exceptional series but was an enjoyable read showing how good of a fighter Wildcat actually is and some more background on him training Bats as well as his links to Catwoman. Its only three issues and I am sure its cheap. Also his assorted appearances in Guy Gardner/GL made me laugh. Ted coming off as a grizzled ex boxer with great one liners and a regular at Warriors kind of made it feel like the superhero version of Cheers. (for the younger people here Cheers was sitcom in a bar "where everyone knows your name", a funny character driven show..imo) Last thought on Wildcat I would buy multiple copies of a limted series or unlimted series if DC ever found the right guy to script it. I think Ted is a great character with a rich history that can still be tapped into. I will always remember when he was "crippled" in the original Crisis on Infinate Earths...its powerful stuff to me and that bothered me as much as Barry Allen dying in that series! (at the time)

The Spectre: I have so many good things to say about this character but I will focus on the John Ostlander/Mandrake series. It was the perfect synthesis of story telling and art.....the pencils of Mandrake were very loose and ethereal when dealing with supernatural happenings. Even the use of a a then tired glow in dark covers actually fit this series. The first issue had one and the Halloween issue (naturally). The attempt to really develop the Jim Corrigan character was impressive and there was no doubt left in the readers mind that the Spectre was not just Corrigan's ghost or even an exaggerated version of his own personality but a completly seperate character (ie: the Wrath of God or the Presence if you like) that Jim was somtimes at odds with. I liked the early issues alot with use of Jim Corrigan's father , the debate on morality, the Spectre's version of Justice (as well as Jims), his friend Amy who was dying of cancer, all of that drama and pathos but done well with some solid philosophical ideas behind it. Also the comsology of the Spectre and how there were other hosts of the Wrath. That was kinda cool. It was rarely talked about before as I remember. In the zero issue in his encounter with Beltane when The Spectre says "You have misjudged my mission Beltane. My purpose is not to purge evil but to confront it, comprehend it, and punish it!" "And whatever your intentions, you are guilty of evil Beltane!" "And on this plane of exsistence there is no escape!" "I call upon the spirits of the Dead those who were slain by you over the centuries. Ask them for mercy." To me those lines break down the Spectre in who he is character wise. There is alot more to that story and I highly reccomend the zero issue and the whole Spectre series. I remember the first isue was in 92 but I can't recall off the top of my head when it ended. I think the series also showed some of the limts of the Spectre's powers and his realtionship with the angels of DCU particually Michael. I think his series was cancelled before he met Zauriel and that would have been cool to see for sure! I mainly remember the first 36 issues or so off the top of my head.

More Spectre highpoints: Any cover by Charles Vess, or Timothy Truman, the use of his old enemies like Azmodus,etc or other demonic bad guys,the use of mystic favorites like Etrigan, Phantom Stranger, Zantanna, Dr Fate etc....a partically funny line from Etrigan when Zee changes her look..."No backwards spells? No fish-net hose?! I hates it when a tradition goes!!" ;\) too funny

Also the Legends of the DCU series that had the Spectre and Hal Jordan in it was great stuff that led into the next ongoing Spectre series.


I am going to have to save the Ray for next time, again I am out of time.


as always good reading to you all ;\)

(I will continue with the Ray)


Thanks for your thoughts on Ted. I have never really payed a whole lot of attention to him besides as a secondary character. He had some great moments in the early issues of Simone's Birds of Prey run and the first JSA series from the early '90s but I have not read the Batman series and I had not given him a lot of attention elsewhere. I will have to go back and check some of these out.

> The Spectre: I have so many good things to say about this character but I will focus on the John Ostlander/Mandrake series. It was the perfect synthesis of story telling and art.....the pencils of Mandrake were very loose and ethereal when dealing with supernatural happenings. Even the use of a a then tired glow in dark covers actually fit this series. The first issue had one and the Halloween issue (naturally). The attempt to really develop the Jim Corrigan character was impressive and there was no doubt left in the readers mind that the Spectre was not just Corrigan's ghost or even an exaggerated version of his own personality but a completly seperate character (ie: the Wrath of God or the Presence if you like) that Jim was somtimes at odds with. I liked the early issues alot with use of Jim Corrigan's father , the debate on morality, the Spectre's version of Justice (as well as Jims), his friend Amy who was dying of cancer, all of that drama and pathos but done well with some solid philosophical ideas behind it. Also the comsology of the Spectre and how there were other hosts of the Wrath. That was kinda cool. It was rarely talked about before as I remember. In the zero issue in his encounter with Beltane when The Spectre says "You have misjudged my mission Beltane. My purpose is not to purge evil but to confront it, comprehend it, and punish it!" "And whatever your intentions, you are guilty of evil Beltane!" "And on this plane of exsistence there is no escape!" "I call upon the spirits of the Dead those who were slain by you over the centuries. Ask them for mercy." To me those lines break down the Spectre in who he is character wise. There is alot more to that story and I highly reccomend the zero issue and the whole Spectre series. I remember the first isue was in 92 but I can't recall off the top of my head when it ended. I think the series also showed some of the limts of the Spectre's powers and his realtionship with the angels of DCU particually Michael. I think his series was cancelled before he met Zauriel and that would have been cool to see for sure! I mainly remember the first 36 issues or so off the top of my head.
>
> More Spectre highpoints: Any cover by Charles Vess, or Timothy Truman, the use of his old enemies like Azmodus,etc or other demonic bad guys,the use of mystic favorites like Etrigan, Phantom Stranger, Zantanna, Dr Fate etc....a partically funny line from Etrigan when Zee changes her look..."No backwards spells? No fish-net hose?! I hates it when a tradition goes!!" ;\) too funny
>
> Also the Legends of the DCU series that had the Spectre and Hal Jordan in it was great stuff that led into the next ongoing Spectre series.
>
I can't agree with you more. I have LOVED this character since I discovered him a few years ago. He is easily my second favorite character in all of the JSA stuff I have read (second only to Alan Scott). As my name implies, I am very interested in all things theological and to have this character whose initial creation centered on him being the incarnation of the wrath of God really piqued my interest. I have sought out as much of his history as I can afford and the only thing I have been really disappointed in thus far was the late 80s run by Moench. That is not a slight to Moench b/c I have read many of his things that have been quite good but the way he handled the Spectre, and especially Corrigan, just seemed to be a compete farce of the character. Just the fact that Madame Xanadu was able to enthrall the Spectre with her femininity and the fact that he seemed to be "one of the guys" so much of the time really seemed to weaken him for me. This coupled with the portrayal of Corrigan just seemed to be off to me. I've read this run twice trying to find good points and I did enjoy the first few issues to some degree but overall it just didn't seem like the Spectre to me. (I also felt that it kind of layed the groundwork for the way the Spectre seemed to be taken in by Eclipso during Infinite Crisis which again seemed to reduce him to the lowest common denominator of a male stereotype being led around by his libido.) I guess I am just a fan of the Spectre as this supernatural being who is beyond those things especially when he is not tethered to a human host. Now that I have rambled enough, I agree that Hal's Spectre was a good twist and I am even finding elements of Crispus Allen's Spectre to like but I will always love Corrigan the most and nobody has portrayed Corrigan as well as Ostrander. The Fleischer stuff in Adventure comics was groundbreaking and great but I just fell in love with the combination of Ostrander's writing and thematic stories and Mandrake's artwork. I hope I haven't gone on too much but I just had to share this with a fellow Spectre fan since I seem to find so few that even really know who he is.

Looking forward to your Ray comments,

The Rev


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