X-Universe >> View Post
·
Post By
The Black Guardian 
Moderator

Member Since: Sat May 17, 2008
Posts: 21,668
In Reply To
Menshevik

Member Since: Sat May 17, 2008
Posts: 3,563
Subj: Re: Has House Of M And Decimation Been Undone, Or Is It Still In Play Or Being Referenced?
Posted: Mon Dec 04, 2017 at 12:57:32 pm EST (Viewed 77 times)
Reply Subj: Re: Has House Of M And Decimation Been Undone, Or Is It Still In Play Or Being Referenced?
Posted: Mon Dec 04, 2017 at 10:17:26 am EST (Viewed 77 times)

Previous Post


    Quote:

      Quote:
      The problem I have is that I don't really see a good reason for wanting to repower everyone (and no, I don't consider a dislike of Brian Bendis and/or for "House of M" good reasons). The Decimation IMO was a sad necessity after Grant Morrison left the X-books with way too many, as in millions too many, mutants.



    Quote:
    I don't understand why this was a problem. We only saw whatever mutants the writer presented to us. There might be ten thousand mutants in the next town but if the story doesn't involve that town, it won't involve those mutants, which means we'll never encounter them.


It did make a difference to the X-Men's mission statement. From the beginning the X-Men were about locating mutants (preferably as soon as their powers manifested themselves), contacting them, preventing mutant supervillains from recruiting them for their purposes, and offering to school them in the use of their powers. If you had ten thousand mutants in the next town and did not show them, you would still have to explain why the X-Men would now effectively be telling them: "You're on your own, if you're pursued by violent mutiphobes don't bother us, we won't help you and we also don't care if you join Apocalypse's legions even though statistical probability would indicate that 10,000 mutants should contain at least 500 strong enough to jointly wipe out the X-Men in one fell swoop."

Few problems can be made to go away by steadfastly ignoring them.

Also, where do you get the figure of six million from? I thought that the 16 million killed in Genosha were less than half of the world's mutant population according to Morrison et al., so there should be at least 16 million (now mostly depowered) mutants around? Or am I misinformed?


    Quote:

      Quote:
      So I can understand if Marvel wants to retain the effects of the Decimation(1), which is to keep the mutant population to a manageable size



    Quote:
    Six million mutants would only be one in every thousand humans. Most of us don't know a thousand people face to face, so most of us would never meet a mutant face to face. How is this unmanageble?


This ratio would mean that there are roughly 20,000 mutants living in the New York Metropolitan Area alone, so the school in Westchester would be too small to cope even with just local/regional demand (recall that there was no indication of there being nearly that many mutants before Morrison - writers tended to work with less than a million mutants worldwide, and some with significantly less than a million - so most of these 20,000 would be in their teens or at most early 20s).


    Quote:

      Quote:
      (especially as in the past two decades the relative importance of the X-books within the totality of Marvel's output has become significantly smaller and as in the past decade interactions between mutant and muggle characters have become a regular thing again).



    Quote:
    I don't understand your logic in the above. Less importance to global story lines means we have to have fewer mutants? Why? Couldn't most of them be sitting at home playing video games and using their amazing ability to stretch their left arm as a way to avoid having to leave their chair to get chips and a beer?


Less importance to the global storylines means that there is even less reason to amp the number of mutants to Morrison's insane levels again than there was immediately after the Decimation.

If there are persons in possession of a superpower in the Marvel Universe they tend to use those powers (narratively it is a bit like "Chekhov's gun"), people who don't ever use them are extremely rare. So you would have to explain to the readers WHY there are millions of superpowered mutants who will not use their powers, even to protect themselves or their loved ones.


    Quote:

      Quote:

      In the meantime, the difficulties "No More Mutants" originally created have AFAIK been overcome: Starting with Hope new mutants can manifest again and to repower your favourite depowered mutant is no more difficult than bringing back dead characters (it is a sad comment on the state of Marvel that I can write that down unironically).



    Quote:
    It just seems tedious to have to resurrect or otherwise "cure" one at a time.


To me it seems a bit too easy and pat to repower them in one go, especially at the price of releasing the genie (of the too high total number of mutants) again that was put back into its bottle by the Decimation.


    Quote:

      Quote:
      (1) Whatever its faults, the Decimation was less stupid and contrived than Morrison's Genoshan genocide which in the end only affected 16 million essentially faceless and nameless "characters" while leaving the already established characters who happened to be on the island (Emma, Lorna, Magnus) unscathed for no good reason. At least "No More Mutants" also affected characters the readers already knew and cared about.



    Quote:
    Well, 16 million mutants on one island was over the top, especially with Magneto as its ruler. It shifted the balance of power too much over to Magneto. It couldn't be allowed to stand. It had to fall. Also, the whole concept had missed the transition of mutant metaphor from racial discrimination to sexual preference discrimination. South Africe as a model was only relevant to the racial discrimination metaphor. Gebnosha had outlived its symbolic usefulness.


Sixteen million was Morrison's idea, before that one could have seen the mutant population of Genosha numbering in their thousands if not their hundreds. So no credit to him for getting rid of a problem that would never have existed without him.

As for Genosha: It had stopped being modeled on South Africa when Magneto took over. And I have to say I have little patience with some forms of fan dogmatism where people hit on a shiny new interpretation and then want to get rid of what in the stories doesn't fit that interpretation ("mutants are a metaphor for homosexuals, so things that make anti-mutant discrimination remind us of racial discrimination must be removed"). Mutation has always been a metaphor for several things, not just minorities of all kinds, but also for the alienation felt by many during puberty. I think it diminishes the fascination of the mutant metaphor to make it exclusively into an allegory of one particular real-world phenomenon, especially if we are talking about phenomena that are also treated non-metaphorically in the stories, like homophobia or racism, that are no longer taboo.


    Quote:

      Quote:

        Quote:
        Depowering El Aguila was heinous. Heinous! I love that guy.



      Quote:
      Let's just say that there are plenty of characters whose depowering or being killed off bothered me more.



    Quote:
    And that's really my point. Everybody has a favorite third tier mutant who occasionally appears and brings a smile to the face. Marvel gained nothing by making that smile impossible.


Oh please! If someone wants to bring back El Aguila, there is nothing to stop them. The little extra effort it would take to repower him is far from prohibitive (are you going to claim that he wasn't worth that effort? \:\-\) ) If what I see from wikipedia and the Marvel Universe wiki is correct, he had not been seen before M-Day since 1988, i.e. a full seventeen years, and all we got to see was a panel in The New Avengers #18 (2006) - which the Marvel Universe wiki does not even consider conclusive evidence that El Aguila was in fact depowered.

Not to mention that even without his electrostatic power he would be an opponent to be reckoned with (as a wannabe Zorro he is an expert swordsman and an experienced acrobat). Or that those electric powers could easily be duplicated with a machine in the Marvel Universe. So IMO the reason why we haven't seen him lately is not the Decimation but the fact that current writers are either unaware of his existence or just not interested in him.




The X-Men were NEVER about locating every last mutant. From the beginning, they simply didn't. They would just locate the ones the got around to locating.

The idea that they did or even tried to just breeds stagnation, imo.


Posted with Mozilla Firefox 57.0 on Windows 10
Alvaro's Comicboards powered by On Topic™ © 2003-2017 Powermad Software
All the content of these boards Copyright © 1996-2017 by Alvaro Ortiz and Dave Galanter. Software Copyright © 2003-2017 Powermad Software